New Tandem Instructor

[djmarvin 2]

Congratulations to Bart Stonestreet (BartRN on dz.com) for completing his UPT and USPA Tandem Instructor Rating. Bart also got to take his first three students this weekend and did a great job! I got to take Bart on his first tandem (as a student) just over three years ago and here is a picture of him getting ready to take me on his first tandem (as an instructor).

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=448340721993&set=a.389922556993.179747.245002841993&ref=nf

DJ Marvin
AFF I/E, Coach/E, USPA/UPT Tandem I/E
http://www.theratingscenter.com

[Para5-0 0]

Welcome aboard and congrats.

Let the games begin....

[BartRN 0]

Thanks for a great class!! Was definately fun to be on the other side this time!

Some canopies can be fun to fly, but treat you like their bitch on opening. -- Jarno

[Beachbum 0]

Congrats Bart! See ya at Wendy's camp in a couple of weeks.

As long as you are happy with yourself ... who cares what the rest of the world thinks?

[kmills0705 0]

Congrats. It's been about 6 weeks since I have had my rating and I am finally getting comfortable with exits (we jump 182's) and taking larger people. I am always seeking advice from the more experienced tandem instructos and continue to learn.

Kim Mills
USPA D21696
Tandem I, AFF I and Static Line I

[riggerrob 643]

Which exit are you doing?

[kmills0705 0]

Rob, diving exit.

Kim Mills
USPA D21696
Tandem I, AFF I and Static Line I

[riggerrob 643]

Quote

Rob, diving exit.

.....................................................................

Good start!
Diving is certainly simpler.

Are you starting from kneeling in the airplane or sitting in the airplane?

Rob Warner
Strong Tandem Examiner

[skydived19006 4]

Quote

Quote

Rob, diving exit.

.....................................................................

Good start!
Diving is certainly simpler.

Are you starting from kneeling in the airplane or sitting in the airplane?

Rob Warner
Strong Tandem Examiner

Same questions I was going to ask Kim.

Kim, do you let the roll go over? I let the front flip go over. I've seen those who don't but you have to leave slightly different, more like stepping off toward the tail as opposed to just rolling.

Martin Myrtle
SAE (that would be Eclipse)/USPA Instructor Examiner.

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[riggerrob 643]

Funny!
BUt I have probably done 2,000 exits from Cessnas and rarely looped. If I dive off, arching like crazy and holding my arms high over head, combined with folding my feet back onto my butt (similar to back-sliding) I find that my spine goes vertical (head down) for about three seconds, the starts to flatten out.
Since you are belly into wind, it is easy to throw in a quick turn for students who ask for loops. Since
the relative wind is still coming from - almost - horizontal/straight ahead, students perceive it (please still wait until you pass the rudder) as a "loop." If you are quick at launching the drogue, you can even do a few fast turns, under drogue, before you flatten out and the student will still perceive that as a loop.

I conclusion, I hate looping exits, but have found ways to stay belly-into-wind, but still allow students to "believe" that they did unstable exits.

[kmills0705 0]

Quote

Funny!
BUt I have probably done 2,000 exits from Cessnas and rarely looped. If I dive off, arching like crazy and holding my arms high over head, combined with folding my feet back onto my butt (similar to back-sliding) I find that my spine goes vertical (head down) for about three seconds, the starts to flatten out.
Since you are belly into wind, it is easy to throw in a quick turn for students who ask for loops. Since
the relative wind is still coming from - almost - horizontal/straight ahead, students perceive it (please still wait until you pass the rudder) as a "loop." If you are quick at launching the drogue, you can even do a few fast turns, under drogue, before you flatten out and the student will still perceive that as a loop.

I conclusion, I hate looping exits, but have found ways to stay belly-into-wind, but still allow students to "believe" that they did unstable exits.

Exactly the same here. I don't go with the loop. Maybe with time and experience I will feel differently, but right now my goal is get stable and get drogue out. My course director emphasized do not use the drogue as a means to get stable - if you do then you need to reevaluate your ability to be a good TI. So for me the sequence is the same as Rob - dive out, arching, feet on ass, and big x with arms. you go into a bit of a heads down orientation and then "slide" out of it to belly - drougue out. It feels like you are going to flip so I am hesitant to get drogue out until I feel us flattening out.

When students ask for flips I say sure and never do them. If there isn't video - they think they did a flip. And even if there is video they aren't complaining - they just had the time of their life. I leave the "cool" stuff to the experienced TI's.

And Rob - yes on knees for hook up.

Kim Mills
USPA D21696
Tandem I, AFF I and Static Line I

[riggerrob 643]

"

Quote

...

And Rob - yes on knees for hook up.

"

......................................................................

Back when I was young and beautiful, I used to hook-up students while kneeling, but over the years I have suffered too many ankle, knee and spinal injuries and been put on too many 20 minute holds by too many air traffic controllers.
Since 1994, I have mostly hooked up while sitting - in Cessnas - or straddling a bobsled bench in Beechcrafts.
Yes, I is difficult to tighten lateral straps while sitting, but I somehow ???? learned how to tighten them most of the way, while sitting and without the student helping. Sorry, but I cannot put my method into words, except that I attatch and tighten one notch, wait a couple minutes, tighten a second notch, wait a couple minutes, tighten a third notch, etc. As the plane turns onto jump run, I tighten the lateral straps one more time and tuck the loose ends.
Why do I tuck loose ends, you may ask?
Richard Bach wrote the answer in "Bridge Across Forever" and suggested that I read it the last time I spoke with him in Snohomish, Washington.

[Cheach 0]

Quote

Congrats. It's been about 6 weeks since I have had my rating and I am finally getting comfortable with exits (we jump 182's) and taking larger people. I am always seeking advice from the more experienced tandem instructos and continue to learn.

I love that picture! Awesome female role model in the sport.

I woke up next to a blowup doll Ash....so what do you think?

[skyrider 0]

Only a cameraman here, but of over 3000 student jumps, the only tandems I saw get into flat spin problems were brought on by Loop Exits..

(like when a Well Known, tandem master went in in Hawaii) I had filmed him maybe 40 + times, and he always looped the exit...

The student is overwhelmed already, why throw a flip in too, overwhelm them more, and incress the danger?


JMO.

[Abedy 0]

Quote

Since 1994, I have mostly hooked up while sitting - in Cessnas - or straddling a bobsled bench in Beechcrafts.
Yes, I is difficult to tighten lateral straps while sitting, but I somehow ???? learned how to tighten them most of the way, while sitting and without the student helping. Sorry, but I cannot put my method into words, except that I attach and tighten one notch, wait a couple minutes, tighten a second notch, wait a couple minutes, tighten a third notch, etc. As the plane turns onto jump run, I tighten the lateral straps one more time and tuck the loose ends.

The method we use here (not only in Gera) is to ask the student (we actually call them either 'guest' or 'pax') "to please sit on my thighs". (This avoids "He told me to sit on his lap!!!!!!eleven") Fastening the lateral straps is quite easy then and if you have students who are too... well, mass/gravity/circumference, you know... you can ask them to help you. But once you know how to do it, it's not that difficult.
And yes, we also always tuck the loose ends... and, BTW, after canopy opening and loosening the lateral straps we have to attach them again and not let them dangle on the sides. Just FYI, no patronising intended

The sky is not the limit. The ground is.

The Society of Skydiving Ducks

[riggerrob 643]

" ...

The method we use here (not only in Germany) is to ask the student (we actually call them either 'guest' or 'pax') "to please sit on my thighs". (This avoids "He told me to sit on his lap!!!!!!eleven") Fastening the lateral straps is quite easy then and if you have students who are too... well, mass/gravity/circumference, you know... you can ask them to help you. ..."

........................................................................

I did it that way for a few years, but eventually found that I could get side straps tight enough by spreading my knees.
Among younger TIS, I notice that they only use that technique with pretty girls.
Hah!
Hah!

[Abedy 0]

Quote

" ...but eventually found that I could get side straps tight enough by spreading my knees.
Among younger TIS, I notice that they only use that technique with pretty girls.
Hah!
Hah!

Huhu huh, you said spread my knees... (Do younger TIs still know Beavis & Butt-Head?)
Anyway, nice trick. Will try it once the no-jumps season (also called winter) is over As for the pretty girls... not to forget to repeatedly check the chest strap

The sky is not the limit. The ground is.

The Society of Skydiving Ducks

[popsjumper 2]

Can I get a tandem with you?
I did one tandem but it was with this guy that kept telling me about the fifth point of attachment.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[popsjumper 2]

Quote

... I got to take Bart on his first tandem (as a student) just over three years ago and here is a picture of him getting ready to take me on his first tandem (as an instructor).

This made me choke up a little.
Isn't it a great feeling to see your young students grow up to be real cowboys?

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[DesertDevil 1]

Quote

Thanks for a great class!! Was definately fun to be on the other side this time!

Congratulations!

[DesertDevil 1]

Quote

Congrats. It's been about 6 weeks since I have had my rating and I am finally getting comfortable with exits (we jump 182's) and taking larger people. I am always seeking advice from the more experienced tandem instructos and continue to learn.

Sweet picture! Congratulations! A few years ago, a man didn't want to do a tandem with me--he'd rather go with the girl manifesting. :) If I see him again, I'll send him your way!

[riggerrob 643]

Yes, I have met a few homophobic male students who insisted on jumping with female tandem mistresses.
Too bad Pitt Meadows is lucky when they have one female tandem mistress
on staff.
The scary part is that the female TIs tend to be physically tougher and more professional than most of their male counter-parts.
Oh!
Wait a minute!
Maybe the homophobes understand the business better than most?????

Rob Warner
Strong Tandem Examiner

[DesertDevil 1]

As an examiner, how often do you graduate female tandem masters? It would be great to have more of them. Do you have any ideas on how we can encourage more women to get their tandem ratings?

[riggerrob 643]

Sorry, but I have only trained one female TI.
The fact that she is more cheerful, more professional and physically stronger than half the male TIs is a great source of embarrassment to some of the male TIs.

I wish we had more female skydivers coming up the pipeline, but to do that, we need more female fun-jumpers to provide positive role models for tandem students.
Tandem students have to believe there is something between "student" and "instructor."
They see how hard TIs work - on their weekends - and seriously question whether they want to work that hard?????

[skydived19006 4]

Quote

Funny!
BUt I have probably done 2,000 exits from Cessnas and rarely looped. If I dive off, arching like crazy and holding my arms high over head, combined with folding my feet back onto my butt (similar to back-sliding) I find that my spine goes vertical (head down) for about three seconds, the starts to flatten out.
Since you are belly into wind, it is easy to throw in a quick turn for students who ask for loops. Since
the relative wind is still coming from - almost - horizontal/straight ahead, students perceive it (please still wait until you pass the rudder) as a "loop." If you are quick at launching the drogue, you can even do a few fast turns, under drogue, before you flatten out and the student will still perceive that as a loop.

I conclusion, I hate looping exits, but have found ways to stay belly-into-wind, but still allow students to "believe" that they did unstable exits.

I know that there are different methods. From my perspective, I've watched TIs exit and hold a large arch which works well enough, usually. The problem that I see is it looks like they are simply arching and waiting, arms and legs outstreached gives you no ability to work with your student. What do you do after a couple of seconds and the student is knees down or flopping like a rag doll and you can't get stable, just keep arching and time the drogue, or go to plan "B" and start working with the student? I like to let the roll go over because I can start reminding my student to arch as soon as we start forward movement. It generally takes, in my experience, a couple of seconds for the student to get over the sensory overload and start thinking again. This is also about the time that we're half way over and it's time to arch again. I consistently get the drogue off at 3 to 4 seconds. I've witnessed guys who do the "arch and wait" method going much longer before it settles out enough to get stable for the drogue. In my opinion, if you're out there arching while the student is de-arching, you stand the potential of ending up on your side in a )( configuration, aka side spin set up! I have in excess of 2000 tandems, and have never felt wind on my side for more than one second, and that only a hand full of times.

All that said, I am 6' 8" with 6' 8" wing span.

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ