freebird 0 #1 January 20, 2002 Im bored with the 135 Sabre not a challange to me anymore . Im going to get a 97 Stiletto or 89 Crossfire. !!!!!!!! IM 100 pounds. Im going to trade my 135 Sabre in for a 97 Stiletto or a Icarus 69 Extreme. I stand my landings up. Im ready for something sporty!!!!!!The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveMonkey 0 #2 January 20, 2002 Quote Sabre 135 .... to Icarus 69 Extreme Bit of a change init? Support the cause - do a skydive(r) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freeflir29 0 #3 January 20, 2002 Canopy nazi trolling are we? If you get one of those...good luck...hope it doesn't kill you. A significant downsize and changing to an elyptical canopy is a lot to deal with. .02"I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TheMarshMan1 0 #4 January 20, 2002 "Im going to trade my 135 Sabre in for a 97 Stiletto or a Icarus 69 Extreme." <---pic worth 1000 words..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Kirils 1 #5 January 21, 2002 Wooo... that's quite a radical change. I would recommend you start by going eliptical at your present size OR go to a smaller square. Don't do both at the same time.Fly fast, but fly safe!Skydiving is not a static excercise with discrete predictability... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites martz 0 #6 January 21, 2002 oh shit ... how many jumps ??Hey get out of my plane !!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freeflir29 0 #7 January 21, 2002 Dear Lisa...I have 27 jumps and I'm thinking of downsizing from my Manta 288 to Cobalt 65. I weigh 312 lbs without gear. Am I making the right decision? "I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Jimbo 0 #8 January 21, 2002 You're not giving yourself enough credit. I suggest you create a canopy from 8 sq ft of wax paper and some used dental floss. It should give you the performance you're looking for and it's economical.Good luck.-Jim Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freebird 0 #9 January 21, 2002 What is are you doing. Making fun of me? I have excellent canopy control skills. Do not make fun of me dude.The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freeflir29 0 #10 January 21, 2002 "I have excellent canopy control skills"Man....I'm sure that's on the list of "Famous last words" "I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freebird 0 #11 January 21, 2002 Clay....... why don't you come out to Skydive Spaceland we can do a jump........ Don't cry when I out track you.The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freeflir29 0 #12 January 21, 2002 "Don't cry when I out track you."I'm sure you can. Not really sure what the hell that has to do with downsizing 40-60 sq ft and going to an entirely new planform at the same time though."I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhreeZone 20 #13 January 21, 2002 OK.... This is CN # 2 here..... Freebird, I've seen your postings and it seems like you are trolling with this post. You are barely off student status, barely able to stay current, and barely seem to know your gear. Trolling on THIS site is'nt taken nicely by quite a few people around here. If you want to troll..... go to rec.skydiving.If you are serious and if you do get a smaller canopy, let me know about your 135, I'm looking for a new canopy and buying it from your parents after you hook it in and are laying in a hospital in critical care should make for a really great bargin. Hell.... even if you just go elliptical let me know, I'm still interested in helping to pay your funeral costs by buying the canopy from your parents.I want to touch the sky, I want to fly so high ~ Sonique Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybytch 273 #14 January 21, 2002 Going on the assumption that this post is not a troll... By excellent canopy control skills you mean that you routinely fly with both toggles and front risers, know how to perform a braked turn and practice it often, land exactly where you want to standing up on every skydive, have landed accurately into the wind, down wind, cross wind, in no wind and in high winds, right? Oh wait. At 50 jumps there's no way in hell you've been exposed to everything that can happen on a skydive. Even the excellent canopy control skills I've described above on a Sabre 135 that you are loading at or under 1.0 does not translate into the ability to safely fly and land an elliptical at 1.2 and above... much less a crossbraced swoop machine like an Extreme (if you could find a gear dealer so unethical as to sell you one). Attempting this at 50 jumps when you aren't making at least 5-10 jumps per week, every week, is just plain stupid. If you're really bored with that 135 why not downsize to a slightly more aggressive 120? Say a Safire or Sabre2. Fly the shit out of that for a couple hundred jumps then think about an elliptical.Or, buy something really small and biff. Just be sure your medical insurance is paid up; forcing the taxpayers to pay the bills for your stupidity is just plain wrong.QuoteThe longer you wait ........the more sense you get. imho, you haven't waited long enough. pull and flare,lisa-- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Aviatrr 0 #15 January 21, 2002 Quote Im going to get a 97 Stiletto or 89 Crossfire. !!!!!!!! IM 100 pounds. Im going to trade my 135 Sabre in for a 97 Stiletto or a Icarus 69 Extreme. The Extreme won't fly well at that light of a wingloading.....better go for the VX46.. I love my VX25 with an 8:1 wing loading......but it's still a bit slow for me.. Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Kelly 0 #16 January 21, 2002 Tiffany,please explain why you would either A) troll outside the Talk back forum, which is specifically designed for whatever we want to say (sangiro created these additional forums for those needed further answer in specific disaplines) * or*B) would actually consider such a drastic downsizing. If youre trying to poke fun at someone or make a point go to the talkback forum. If youre seriously considering this, god help you.http://kel197.tripod.com/skydivefriendsTRIPOD/html Updated!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Kelly 0 #17 January 21, 2002 now youve got me getting serious. you posted this in the first place, but you didnt ask any questions. Do you have any? Have wing loadings been explained properly to you? can you correctly calculate one? cause if youre doing it wrong, and dont fully understand it, then you could possibly come up with a number that seems reasonable (even though it should raise a mental flag).are you getting the correct guidance at your home dropzone? remember that jumpers with out YEARS in the sport and many many jumps arent always guiding you in the right direction. were at about the same level. Ive only got 64 jumps. the thought of loading 1:1 (which I am now) involved a whole lot. Recurrency, upsizing first before i went back to what i was jumping before then eventually downsizing, traveling 2,500 miles for 5 1/2 weeks to better jumping conditions, canopy control jumps, lots of solos and Hop and pops (not from 3 grand either, descent altitude), testing my skills (landing off, crosswind etc etc) granted, i went to the extreames, i even gave up the thought of going on a non skydiving trip to OZ b/c i thought my skydiving/canopy skills couldnt afford a break at this point but sometimes more emphasis on taking it easy is better.lemme tell you, i wasnt standing many landings up before i got hurt. 7 weeks w/out jumping, by the third jump i was standing them all up (and have, save the reserve ride). The desicion to downsize again came only after careful analasis, lots of landings on video being seen time and time again, consideration of altitude, winds, landing area, landing conditions, other canopy pilots (who id be in the sky with under this smaller, new canopy), and safety. I wont be downsizing again for a long time, many many jumps.. Its not that fast, but i need to learn a lot more on the 135I hope all these posts just affirm that little voice in your head thats telling you this is a bad idea. downsize reasonably, one size at a time.. not a good deal smaller and eliptical.Sincerely,kel http://kel197.tripod.com/skydivefriendsTRIPOD/html Updated!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skycat 0 #18 January 21, 2002 Tiffany, Ok, I have a feeling you posted this just to see what people would say. If you didn't, and you are really serious, I want to know who out at Spaceland you have been talking to that wants you to downsize. I know the downsize competions out there, and I've seen the participants get hurt, and we have bets going on several of the other ones. Have you seen John Lee lately, he isn't wearing that back brace to make a fashion statement. Yes I now jump a 104, and yes you will be able to jump one too, someday that is. I have/had about 300 jumps before I went that small, and I weight the same amount as you. Actually I would still be jumping my 116 if Icarus hadn't agreed to replace my defective crossfire. All you have to do to get there is get somemore jumps under your belt, stay current, the one jump a month that I've seen you do in the past isn't going to cut it. Bring that 135 out to Skydive Houston and have Derek give you some coaching, I know you don't have a rig yet, but I still have my old Reflex that that thing will fit perfect in, you can jump it all weekend if you want to. He will tell you honestly if you are ready for something smaller, or elliptical. If you posted this because you are pissed/freaked out about the way people out at spaceland are downsizing before they are ready, or it is making you feel uncomfortable because you aren't on something that small, they are scaring you in the air, or whatever. Just remember that not everyone is in a race to downsize even if it seems that way. Some people actually make the decision based on thier flying and where they want to go with thier canopy skills, not just becuase everyone else is doing it.Ask yourself what do you really want out of your canopy. I did this when I was deciding what size to get my replacement canopy, I said I wanted something that would be able to penetrate the wind, that on no wind days wasn't a death defying feat to land, something I could land in someones backyard, and one that would give me the ability to learn more. What do you really want out of your canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freebird 0 #19 January 21, 2002 My parents hooked it in and died. I do not appreciate the negative comments.The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freebird 0 #20 January 21, 2002 I was not joking.........excuse me EVERYONE for the post. I will take the post off if it bothers everyone so much!!!!!!!!The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freebird 0 #21 January 21, 2002 I have been talking to a couple of people at at dz in Louisiana and other places.. I do not see the problem. I have been practicing at another dz. I will pull high. Im sorry I posted that. Im taking it off. It offened some people. The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skycat 0 #22 January 21, 2002 QuoteI will take the post off if it bothers everyone so much!!!!!!!!The post doesn't bother anyone, it's scares them. What happened this weekend? You used to make smart decisions, now it appears cause one person said that at 60 jumps you can handle a 1.7 wingloading you want to go for it. So at 60 jumps you are ready for what icarus calls a class 5 extreem canopy wingloading.----------------------------------------Class 5Extreme1.65 to 2.00 Lbs/SqFt wing loading Not for the faint hearted. If you are one of the few people that want to fly a class 5 canopy consider every aspect of what you are doing very carefully. On the up side there is very exhilarating airspeed, quick response times and powerful maneuverability. On the down side our margin for error has reduced to almost nothing (!), compounded by the fact that if we do make an error we are almost certainly traveling at speeds that can maim. If you have or are considering a class 5 canopy we can't tell you how to fly it in this overview, we must assume you know what you are doing. Most people I watch flying class 5 canopies don't fly them to the limits of the canopy and the performance they achieve from their canopy could be achieved from a class 4 canopy flown to its limits with a far greater safety margin. These canopies generally have to be run out on landing. They must be fitted with a collapsible pilot chute. Lowering and collapsing the slider and loosening the chest strap is recommended. Canopy recovery arcs can be over 400 Ft radius. The step from a class 4 canopy to a class 5 canopy can be quite large i.e. for a 80 kg jumper with gear and weights the difference between a 105 and a 95 feels similar to the difference between a 130 and a 105.--------------------------------I'd say come out to Waller and jump my 104, that should scare you plenty into reconsidering your decision, but Derek would kick my ass if I did that. Oh well it's your decision, just make it an informed one, and not one cause someone who doesn't know you says it's ok to fly it.Kelli Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freebird 0 #23 January 21, 2002 I actually have more than 60 jumps now. I will practice at another dz before I land something new at a busy drop zone. It will be 8 to 10 weeks before I even get a new canopy. Im jumping the 150 again while I wait. The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhreeZone 20 #24 January 21, 2002 What gear dealer would even sell you something like that? If its a DZO or a JM selling it..... they have other things to worry about other then your safety, like making a quick buck off some unsuspecting skydiver. Let me know how much you want for the 150. I like to be generous to people with not much time left to live.......I want to touch the sky, I want to fly so high ~ Sonique Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skycat 0 #25 January 21, 2002 ok....the last think I'm going to say on this, is demo first before you buy, cause it's your $$$$$ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 1 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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freeflir29 0 #3 January 20, 2002 Canopy nazi trolling are we? If you get one of those...good luck...hope it doesn't kill you. A significant downsize and changing to an elyptical canopy is a lot to deal with. .02"I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheMarshMan1 0 #4 January 20, 2002 "Im going to trade my 135 Sabre in for a 97 Stiletto or a Icarus 69 Extreme." <---pic worth 1000 words..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kirils 1 #5 January 21, 2002 Wooo... that's quite a radical change. I would recommend you start by going eliptical at your present size OR go to a smaller square. Don't do both at the same time.Fly fast, but fly safe!Skydiving is not a static excercise with discrete predictability... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
martz 0 #6 January 21, 2002 oh shit ... how many jumps ??Hey get out of my plane !!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #7 January 21, 2002 Dear Lisa...I have 27 jumps and I'm thinking of downsizing from my Manta 288 to Cobalt 65. I weigh 312 lbs without gear. Am I making the right decision? "I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 0 #8 January 21, 2002 You're not giving yourself enough credit. I suggest you create a canopy from 8 sq ft of wax paper and some used dental floss. It should give you the performance you're looking for and it's economical.Good luck.-Jim Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freebird 0 #9 January 21, 2002 What is are you doing. Making fun of me? I have excellent canopy control skills. Do not make fun of me dude.The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #10 January 21, 2002 "I have excellent canopy control skills"Man....I'm sure that's on the list of "Famous last words" "I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freebird 0 #11 January 21, 2002 Clay....... why don't you come out to Skydive Spaceland we can do a jump........ Don't cry when I out track you.The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #12 January 21, 2002 "Don't cry when I out track you."I'm sure you can. Not really sure what the hell that has to do with downsizing 40-60 sq ft and going to an entirely new planform at the same time though."I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #13 January 21, 2002 OK.... This is CN # 2 here..... Freebird, I've seen your postings and it seems like you are trolling with this post. You are barely off student status, barely able to stay current, and barely seem to know your gear. Trolling on THIS site is'nt taken nicely by quite a few people around here. If you want to troll..... go to rec.skydiving.If you are serious and if you do get a smaller canopy, let me know about your 135, I'm looking for a new canopy and buying it from your parents after you hook it in and are laying in a hospital in critical care should make for a really great bargin. Hell.... even if you just go elliptical let me know, I'm still interested in helping to pay your funeral costs by buying the canopy from your parents.I want to touch the sky, I want to fly so high ~ Sonique Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #14 January 21, 2002 Going on the assumption that this post is not a troll... By excellent canopy control skills you mean that you routinely fly with both toggles and front risers, know how to perform a braked turn and practice it often, land exactly where you want to standing up on every skydive, have landed accurately into the wind, down wind, cross wind, in no wind and in high winds, right? Oh wait. At 50 jumps there's no way in hell you've been exposed to everything that can happen on a skydive. Even the excellent canopy control skills I've described above on a Sabre 135 that you are loading at or under 1.0 does not translate into the ability to safely fly and land an elliptical at 1.2 and above... much less a crossbraced swoop machine like an Extreme (if you could find a gear dealer so unethical as to sell you one). Attempting this at 50 jumps when you aren't making at least 5-10 jumps per week, every week, is just plain stupid. If you're really bored with that 135 why not downsize to a slightly more aggressive 120? Say a Safire or Sabre2. Fly the shit out of that for a couple hundred jumps then think about an elliptical.Or, buy something really small and biff. Just be sure your medical insurance is paid up; forcing the taxpayers to pay the bills for your stupidity is just plain wrong.QuoteThe longer you wait ........the more sense you get. imho, you haven't waited long enough. pull and flare,lisa-- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aviatrr 0 #15 January 21, 2002 Quote Im going to get a 97 Stiletto or 89 Crossfire. !!!!!!!! IM 100 pounds. Im going to trade my 135 Sabre in for a 97 Stiletto or a Icarus 69 Extreme. The Extreme won't fly well at that light of a wingloading.....better go for the VX46.. I love my VX25 with an 8:1 wing loading......but it's still a bit slow for me.. Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kelly 0 #16 January 21, 2002 Tiffany,please explain why you would either A) troll outside the Talk back forum, which is specifically designed for whatever we want to say (sangiro created these additional forums for those needed further answer in specific disaplines) * or*B) would actually consider such a drastic downsizing. If youre trying to poke fun at someone or make a point go to the talkback forum. If youre seriously considering this, god help you.http://kel197.tripod.com/skydivefriendsTRIPOD/html Updated!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kelly 0 #17 January 21, 2002 now youve got me getting serious. you posted this in the first place, but you didnt ask any questions. Do you have any? Have wing loadings been explained properly to you? can you correctly calculate one? cause if youre doing it wrong, and dont fully understand it, then you could possibly come up with a number that seems reasonable (even though it should raise a mental flag).are you getting the correct guidance at your home dropzone? remember that jumpers with out YEARS in the sport and many many jumps arent always guiding you in the right direction. were at about the same level. Ive only got 64 jumps. the thought of loading 1:1 (which I am now) involved a whole lot. Recurrency, upsizing first before i went back to what i was jumping before then eventually downsizing, traveling 2,500 miles for 5 1/2 weeks to better jumping conditions, canopy control jumps, lots of solos and Hop and pops (not from 3 grand either, descent altitude), testing my skills (landing off, crosswind etc etc) granted, i went to the extreames, i even gave up the thought of going on a non skydiving trip to OZ b/c i thought my skydiving/canopy skills couldnt afford a break at this point but sometimes more emphasis on taking it easy is better.lemme tell you, i wasnt standing many landings up before i got hurt. 7 weeks w/out jumping, by the third jump i was standing them all up (and have, save the reserve ride). The desicion to downsize again came only after careful analasis, lots of landings on video being seen time and time again, consideration of altitude, winds, landing area, landing conditions, other canopy pilots (who id be in the sky with under this smaller, new canopy), and safety. I wont be downsizing again for a long time, many many jumps.. Its not that fast, but i need to learn a lot more on the 135I hope all these posts just affirm that little voice in your head thats telling you this is a bad idea. downsize reasonably, one size at a time.. not a good deal smaller and eliptical.Sincerely,kel http://kel197.tripod.com/skydivefriendsTRIPOD/html Updated!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skycat 0 #18 January 21, 2002 Tiffany, Ok, I have a feeling you posted this just to see what people would say. If you didn't, and you are really serious, I want to know who out at Spaceland you have been talking to that wants you to downsize. I know the downsize competions out there, and I've seen the participants get hurt, and we have bets going on several of the other ones. Have you seen John Lee lately, he isn't wearing that back brace to make a fashion statement. Yes I now jump a 104, and yes you will be able to jump one too, someday that is. I have/had about 300 jumps before I went that small, and I weight the same amount as you. Actually I would still be jumping my 116 if Icarus hadn't agreed to replace my defective crossfire. All you have to do to get there is get somemore jumps under your belt, stay current, the one jump a month that I've seen you do in the past isn't going to cut it. Bring that 135 out to Skydive Houston and have Derek give you some coaching, I know you don't have a rig yet, but I still have my old Reflex that that thing will fit perfect in, you can jump it all weekend if you want to. He will tell you honestly if you are ready for something smaller, or elliptical. If you posted this because you are pissed/freaked out about the way people out at spaceland are downsizing before they are ready, or it is making you feel uncomfortable because you aren't on something that small, they are scaring you in the air, or whatever. Just remember that not everyone is in a race to downsize even if it seems that way. Some people actually make the decision based on thier flying and where they want to go with thier canopy skills, not just becuase everyone else is doing it.Ask yourself what do you really want out of your canopy. I did this when I was deciding what size to get my replacement canopy, I said I wanted something that would be able to penetrate the wind, that on no wind days wasn't a death defying feat to land, something I could land in someones backyard, and one that would give me the ability to learn more. What do you really want out of your canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freebird 0 #19 January 21, 2002 My parents hooked it in and died. I do not appreciate the negative comments.The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freebird 0 #20 January 21, 2002 I was not joking.........excuse me EVERYONE for the post. I will take the post off if it bothers everyone so much!!!!!!!!The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freebird 0 #21 January 21, 2002 I have been talking to a couple of people at at dz in Louisiana and other places.. I do not see the problem. I have been practicing at another dz. I will pull high. Im sorry I posted that. Im taking it off. It offened some people. The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skycat 0 #22 January 21, 2002 QuoteI will take the post off if it bothers everyone so much!!!!!!!!The post doesn't bother anyone, it's scares them. What happened this weekend? You used to make smart decisions, now it appears cause one person said that at 60 jumps you can handle a 1.7 wingloading you want to go for it. So at 60 jumps you are ready for what icarus calls a class 5 extreem canopy wingloading.----------------------------------------Class 5Extreme1.65 to 2.00 Lbs/SqFt wing loading Not for the faint hearted. If you are one of the few people that want to fly a class 5 canopy consider every aspect of what you are doing very carefully. On the up side there is very exhilarating airspeed, quick response times and powerful maneuverability. On the down side our margin for error has reduced to almost nothing (!), compounded by the fact that if we do make an error we are almost certainly traveling at speeds that can maim. If you have or are considering a class 5 canopy we can't tell you how to fly it in this overview, we must assume you know what you are doing. Most people I watch flying class 5 canopies don't fly them to the limits of the canopy and the performance they achieve from their canopy could be achieved from a class 4 canopy flown to its limits with a far greater safety margin. These canopies generally have to be run out on landing. They must be fitted with a collapsible pilot chute. Lowering and collapsing the slider and loosening the chest strap is recommended. Canopy recovery arcs can be over 400 Ft radius. The step from a class 4 canopy to a class 5 canopy can be quite large i.e. for a 80 kg jumper with gear and weights the difference between a 105 and a 95 feels similar to the difference between a 130 and a 105.--------------------------------I'd say come out to Waller and jump my 104, that should scare you plenty into reconsidering your decision, but Derek would kick my ass if I did that. Oh well it's your decision, just make it an informed one, and not one cause someone who doesn't know you says it's ok to fly it.Kelli Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freebird 0 #23 January 21, 2002 I actually have more than 60 jumps now. I will practice at another dz before I land something new at a busy drop zone. It will be 8 to 10 weeks before I even get a new canopy. Im jumping the 150 again while I wait. The longer you wait ........the more sense you get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #24 January 21, 2002 What gear dealer would even sell you something like that? If its a DZO or a JM selling it..... they have other things to worry about other then your safety, like making a quick buck off some unsuspecting skydiver. Let me know how much you want for the 150. I like to be generous to people with not much time left to live.......I want to touch the sky, I want to fly so high ~ Sonique Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skycat 0 #25 January 21, 2002 ok....the last think I'm going to say on this, is demo first before you buy, cause it's your $$$$$ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
