Paragliding versus Skydiving

[roq 0]

Does anybody have experience of Paragliding and Skydiving?
I tried Paragliding and I was with the idea that is very easy the flight with a paragliding canopy for a esperienced skydiver.
Is right that exist differences in behavior of the canopies in strong wind conditions and thermal activity, in colapses, in the speeds etc.
I would like to see the opinions of who had this experience.

Roq

[nicknitro71 0]

I am no paragliding expert but few years back I took some lessons and did not like it. I understand that those canopies are designed to soar but it was boring flying them coming from SD. Then I took some hang-gliding lessons and I got hooked. Few months later I bought an hang-gliger!

I know HGs are combersome but once you are flying them all the weight and size dissapear.

As for paragliding I like the idea of the portability but it is just plain boring flying for me.

Nonetheless you should give a try (to both!)

Cool

Memento Audere Semper

903

[cobaltdan 0]

first time i tried paragliding i thought it was fun but a bit boring. my partner put me on a raged out old paraglider down a ski slope. big and docile....

the second time i tried paragliding i was hooked. this time a dhv3 competition wing. first off it is a bizzare feeling to be able to accend in a canopy, second even though they are bigger wings than what we are used to the right wing is every bit as acrobatic and in fact more so than a skydiving wing.

i.e. when is the last time you front looped your skydiving canopy? the freakiest part to me learning was all of the diferent possible (non serious) collapses you can induce. first notion is sh^t cut away cut away....woops you cant. aerobatics on a paraglider can put higher g forces on you than a skydiving canopy (longer lines).

anyway i highly recommend to all skydiving canopy pilots to give paragliding a try. just understand that the canopy you try first will be a dog. you will transition quickly to a fun wing, just give it a chance.

sincerely,

dan<><>

Daniel Preston <><>
atairaerodynamics.com (sport)
atairaerospace.com (military)

[nicknitro71 0]

Good point Dan. I did have a dog as training paraglider.

Have you ever tried hang gliding?

Nick

Memento Audere Semper

903

[cobaltdan 0]

no, not unless you count the 33 sq foot rigid wing i ran off a cliff with....

my partner however has been hangliding forever and i can wait to learn.

sincerely,

dan<><>

Daniel Preston <><>
atairaerodynamics.com (sport)
atairaerospace.com (military)

[jwilson 0]

I tried to do some paragliding in CA last July but never quite got the hang of ground handling (kiting), the winds we're up the whole tome I was there so that didn't help . I 'll probably try it again this summer. Hang gliding is alot of fun , In Fl we tow them to alt with an ultralight . Towing is fun too. Sometimes a little scary on launch . I still like skydiving the best .

Jay

[pchapman 279]

Here's a long answer for you and anyone else:

It can be a more relaxed sport than skydiving, providing a lot more time airborne. I've had flights of an hour just ridge soaring along a 200 foot high hill, and flights of a few hours at better sites. When the winds and weather don't cooperate, though, then you get to do a lot of parawaiting or short glides straight to the bottom of the hill.

Being a skydiver helps somewhat in paragliding, mainly just in general comfort with being airborne, having a feel for speeds and descent rates, evaluating wind and weather, and having a basic understanding of aerodynamics.

But there are so many details that are different, where one has to really pay attention to the differences. Not only are the canopies big, but they're trimmed to fly efficiently, not like the ground-hungry trim angle used for many skydiving canopies. Their large size means they react more slowly than small ZP skydiving canopies, but the long lines, high aspect ratio, and improved aerodynamics mean that the canopy has more of a mind of its own when the canopy becomes distorted as in a stall. The canopy can build up a lot more momentum, and can't be flung around as quickly as a small skydiving canopy. Still, very advanced pilots do some incredible aerobatics, including loops and helicopter spins.

As people have said before, paragliding has its own instructional system, and it is dangerous to try to do without. At the very beginner level, however, paragliding is so ludicrously easy to do; anyone can be taught to fly short flights down a hundred foot training hill in smooth winds in a few hours.

Although paragliding can include floating about in nice conditions, it can also involve a lot of concentration. There's risk from being closer to the ground for longer. If ridge soaring a smaller site, one may be repeatedly flying back and forth fifty feet off the trees. Any misjudgement of the turns or of changes in the wind can result in dropping into the trees.
(Just what conditions a paraglider pilot will fly in depends a lot on their local sites, whether they are flying low ridges or high mountains, ridge soaring, or flying in thermals.)

Because of paragliders' low speeds, and the tendency of winds to speed up as they cross over hills, paragliders can't fly in as strong winds as hang gliders do. Paraglider pilots must be careful not to get "blown back" over the back of the hill, where the turbulence can literally be a killer.

Compared to skydiving, a paraglider pilot needs to learn more about micrometeorolgy. At least skydivers are given a basic understanding of thermals and turbulence around obstacles.

Paragliders do have to be flown more carefully than parachutes in stronger wind or thermal conditions. (And those are also the conditions where it is easier to stay airborne.) Paragliders are subject to partial collapses, typically where one tip or one whole side of the canopy will fold under. Everyone trains for dealing with it, preventing the canopy from starting to spiral, and reinflating the collapsed side.

Paraglider stalls can be quite violent and are normally not done until one is experienced. A bad recovery can sling the pilot into the lines and canopy. If a pilot is not aware of the feel of their canopy, it isn't hard to stall one side of the canopy when making a deeply braked turn. It's easy not to notice that kind of stall creeping up, even on a student canopy.

Ground handling a paraglider in moderate winds takes practice. The pilot is dealing with a giant kite that'll pull them off their feet and drag them into the bushes if they don't handle it right. One can spend hours practicing ground handling, just kiting the glider on level ground.

Some background flight & construction data:
Paragliding canopies are normally quite large, 24 - 28 sq. metres (260 - 300 ft sq). Glide ratios are above 6:1 even for beginner wings now. Speeds are slow, such as 35-40 km/h in full flight (22-25 mph), and 50+ km/h (30+ mph) using the speedbar -- a sophisticated equivalent to pulling down the front risers but using a foot-actuated cord. The cell count (counting each chamber, so a "9-cell" skydiving canopy would be =18) is about 35 to 75. Aspect ratios 5 to 6.

Peter Chapman
(25 hours paraglider airtime)

[listo 0]

Quote

. first off it is a bizzare feeling to be able to accend in a canopy

I had a tandem once that weighed about 85 pounds and it was during the summer so the thermals were kickin We had about a 20 min canopy ride from 5,000.......does that count?

Live today as tomorrow may not come

[roq 0]

After having made about 140 paragliding flights in interior zones
in conditions of dynamic and thermal flight. Also after to have tried the
paramotor flight, I judge, although it am still initiate, to be to the height for, of
a brief form, to do an analogy between the skydiving and paragliding,
establishing common points between an and other activity, the degree of
danger, as well as the advantage of her to have practiced one of this activited for to begin in the
other and the knowledge and learning common to the two.

I flew with 7 different wings beginning (for the roof) with a wing level 3,
then level 2 and finally level 1/2 that is it more adapted in terms of
safety for an initiate pilot. (That this doesn't serve of example to anybody)

Only for to clear, the levels of the wings in the paragliding according to the norms
international DHV settles down in 3 levels; level 1 initiation, level 2
advanced, level 3 competition. And the more high the
performante level also more dangerous it is the wing of flying.

The image

Usually, for us skydivers the image that reveals of the paragliding is
that is a calm when compared with the skydiving, that is as the
like the line fishes, to go for a walk calmly in the sky without anything of abnormal to happen. That it is
activity for the " slack " ones that don't get to jump of an airplane.

For the paragliding it idea of the skydiving it is that is an activity
for crazy boys that jump of an airplane and they only want to arrive here below more the
quickly possible. For these the canopy is not wings that fly
but yes just nylon mushrooms that seek to soften the fall of the
paraquedista to the ground.

The reality

The reality is not a nor other, it is very different
The free flight can be a calm, relaxing activity, without any
assail when practiced the coastal zones close to, with flowed winds and
soft coming of the sea. There there is not fright any we just hovered in the
space, singing and whistling and contemplating everything that the landscape can
to offer for us.

But when the conditions are stronger and we passed for the zones of
interior, close to the mountains, where there is always some coming turbulence
of the relief and irregularities of the land, of the venturis provoked by the
throats and of the thermal ones always presents, there the situation radically moves
of a soft flight we passed to an agitated flight, ascents and gone down vertiginous,
a constant fight to maintain the wing to fly well, to avoid
pendulums and swingings, fechos and front or lateral collapses that can
to bring us for the ground the high-speed in an unrecoverable spinning.

Also the paragliding pilot in general walks a little far away from the truth when speaks
of the skydiving.
The today canopy is just as wing paragliding, perfect machines
of high flight performance that they no only are destined for the coming the jumper
for the soil, but also to provide it the pleasure to fly, although more
down, and to terrify with aerobatics and fantastic flares.
For besides the classic accuracy competitions precision practiced there is
decades with canopy Ram Air, today they are already made international competitions
of flare, speed and precision in wings of HP with great inpact mediatic

If the skydiving demands great courage and autodominio to leave of the airplane and
to practice free fall, the free flight demands it in the same way to fly in
situations as the I described.

If many students interrupt the skydivers activity for desmotivation
or lack of money, which, in fact and in the great maioriate of the cases it doesn't pass of that the
that commonly we called fear ", the same happens with the apprentices of
paragliding

The perigosidade degree

The degree of potential danger I think equivalent in an and in another activity
If in the skydiving we have basically the danger of the bad operations, of the
shocks and of the aterragens, in the paragliding we have the danger of the descolagens, of the
I fly and of the aterragens, still added to the dangers imponderable resultants of the
unexpected alterations of the meteorological conditions
Still having the danger of the excess of self-confidence, especially of us
skydivers that can take us to belittle the conditions adapted for the
practice of the paragliding, taking us per times to confuse courage with
inconsciência and to assume purposeless risks.

The pilotagem technique

For the jumper it is very important the experience acquired in the control of
canopy for the paragliding practice and vice-versa. The beginnings
of control they are basically the same ones. They completely just modify
some parameters as the slopes that are much more flat in the
paragliding, the answer to the inputs that it is much slower in the paragliding and the
it forms of flying that for besides the normal toggle inputs it is supported by the
weight transfer (inclination) in the chair of the paragliding. The same already
we make some of us in the swoop to support the manobradores turns and to dive more
in canopy of high performance.
There is also a device of acceleration, the foot (bar) accelerator that actuando in the
suspension risers (bands) it alters the inclination of the wing (trim). just as us
we do in the canopies but alone actuando in the front risers.
In the paragliding the main goal is to win height, per times the difficult is to come
down.
In the skydiving the difficult is to be there on top, the main goal is the
gone down.

Advantages of learning paragliding and skydiving

As it is I obviate it is advantageous to be paragliding experienced pilot for
to begin in the skydiving, as it is it to be also expert skydiver for
to begin in the paragliding. basically the flight feeling is the same and the
accumulated larger or smaller experience is very important for to give us the
good information on the heights, reactions of the wing to the inputs,
vertical and horizontal speeds and glide ratios.
There is even so, that to notice the limitations and differences of behavior well of
an and other and to respect them
For example it is absolutely normal a jumper to continue with the inflate wing
after the landing same with strong wind. Such it is unthinkable in the paragliding and it can
to bring serious resulting consequences of a sudden increase of the wind that
it cannot us catapultar against the soil or a sharp rock. As it happened with me
It happened after I landed in the same place that I made the take-off (Top Landing)
I was, in unbalance situation on a rock to contemplate the wing
open on my head, almost time, the wind increased
suddenly and I wrapped up and feeling an impact of a sharp stone in the
my integral helmet that was there very marked. I leave unhurt but I was safe
for the helmet and for the chair that has a foam protecção of big
thickness.
The same problems can happen in the take-off.
The paragliding pilot always needs to become a specialist in meteorology for
to practice in safety and to take advantage of the conditions for to fly,
that is just important until a certain level in the skydiving that
things like with the limits of the wind, visibility and immediate forecasts.

The emotion

In an and in another practice there is plenty of emotion
In the skydiving she is without doubts more brutal " because everything happens much more
fast with more intensity. There is not anything that substitutes the exit and the free fall

In the paragliding the flight in strong, thermal and dynamic situations, is without doubts
a continuous and permanent emotion. It is never known what comes to proceed. One
alone activity for some. You can can believe.

The costs (In Portugal)
Basic course of paragliding 300 euros
Basic course (static line) of skydiving 350 euros
An paragliding complet equipment, chair, wing, reserve canopy,
helmet, new it will cost about 3500 euros
A skydiving complete equipment, container, main and reserve, cypres altimeter,
suit and helmet about the 6000 euros
The cost of the flights is the travel for the place
The cost of the jumps about 20 euros
The duration of the material
paragliding 300/500 hours
Parachute canopy about 1000 jumps

Maintenances
In the paragliding, brook lines and fabric tears for traction in the landing
or take off is frequent
In the skydiving are less vulgar the damages, but they you need too packing
the reserve of 4 in 4 or 6 months 20/40 euros, batteries for cypres 500 jumps or 2 years /
75 euros, maintenance of the cypres 4 in 4 years about 200 euros

Generalities and Construction

Glide ratio / Finess
Paragliding 6/1 to 9.5/1
Parachute canopy 2/1 to 4.5/1

Horizontal speed
Paragliding 20 to 65 Km/h
Parachute Canopy 20 to 100 Km/h


I number of cells
Wing of paragliding 30 to 70
Parachute canopys 5 to 36

Aspect ratio
Paragliding 3,5 /1 to 6,5 /1
Parachute canopy 1,6/1 to 3/1

Surface
Paragliding 23 to 30 m2
Parachute canopy 6 to 30 m2

Fabric
Paragliding Nylon Ripstop impermebilizado of high density
Parachute canopy Nylon Ripstop low porositate and Z Po low
density

Lines
Paragliding 250 to 300 meters aramid or covered kevlar or dynema
Parachute canopy 60 to 200 meters Dracon, Aramid, Spectra or Dynema

Weight
paragliding 5, 5 Kg for 7Kg
canopy 1,5 Kg to 4 Kg

The means

They are without doubts larger for the practice of the paragliding. Any cliff or
set up disencumbered and turned to the predominant wind they can serve for
to practice. In the skydiving we are always restricted to the airplane, or
that make BASE.

Conclusion

The skydiving is a fascinating, touching experience. brutal and until almost
sensual
The paragliding fascinating and touching and almost spiritual experience
An activity doesn't substitute the other, it is even something descabido to be to do
comparisons among them. I face them as complemental to each other for who
it likes the air.

Sincerely I recommend to some and others that try and practice the two.

My experience:
2100 Skydive Jumps with main canopys with 300 to 75 sq ft

150 paragliding flyings with wings livel III, livel II and I

Roq

[trigger 0]

One word...WICKED!!!!
Unfortunately i can't afford to do both,Respect

.CHOP WOOD COLLECT WATER.

[Kirils 1]

I skydive. I'm a private pilot who has a hangliding cert. I recently purchased a paraglider. It seems harder than it looks. While just a newbi, I became well aware of the dangers fast. You can fly in and out of a thermal very quickly and find yourself stuck in a bad area. The canopy is really sluggish and I need to anticipate well in advance my flight path. I'm giving it up until next spring when I can get down to the Outer Banks in NC and fly more safely over the sand dunes. I am only speaking for my ascending canopy designed for beginners. I bought it cheap, it sounds like the HP's are more fun.