rhino 0 #26 June 7, 2003 Quotethe crossfire 2 I believe is the highest performance non crossbraced canopy on the market. I agree... Because I have one too Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #27 June 7, 2003 QuoteI'd get a vengeance over a crossfire 2 simply based on the line trim fiasco the crossfires had. What do you prefer about the Vengeance over the Crossfire2? How many jumps do you have on the crossfire2? What difference in dive and turn rate between the 2?? Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #28 June 7, 2003 Turn rate is'nt everything. I'll turn down canopies that turn too fast for my liking and take sometihng slower turning, but more enjoyable for me. Even dive distance is'nt everything. The Vengence has a very long recovery arc, its as long as your going to get with out going crossbraced pretty much. For a lot of pilots the arc can be too long, they have trouble judging distace when they are 500 feet up but at 300 they are fine, I'm this way a lot. I prefer my canopies to have a tad less of a dive as long as they hold their speed. What one pilot likes about a canopy, another dozen hate.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #29 June 7, 2003 QuoteWhat one pilot likes about a canopy, another dozen hate. *** True enough.. For me? The faster it turns the better.. The longer it dives andthe more speed it picks up the better!! Yeagh baby!! Yeagh!! Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jsfreefly76 0 #30 June 9, 2003 I got a demo vengence in and put a few jumps on it, but you wanna know what I bought? Crossfire 2! This is my second Crossfire and I love it better than the first. As far as PD's customer service is concerned, I have a really good friend that bought a new sabre 2. His first jump on it, smacked him and broke 2 lines. PD's responce was that it was the containers fault and they wouldn't cover the repair. 1st jump! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Trent 0 #31 June 10, 2003 I find that PD wouldn't take care of that problem very hard to believe. Either your story is lacking some kind of important details, or your friend called the wrong number. PD has an entire section on their factory floor devoted to maintenace and repair, it wouldn't take them a day of labor to get that fixed. Our rigger hadn't ever jumped a Velocity and just bought one. He thought it danced a little too much on opening so he called PD. They sent him a demo to use while they test jumped his canopy and made any necessary changes at no cost. That doesn't sound like a company that would outright deny a repair or investigation for a canopy that someone just bought.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites tattoojeff 0 #32 June 10, 2003 your freind must be leaving something out of his story. my girlfreind bought a new saber2. its openings were consitantly slamers so she called pd. they asked her to try a few recomemdations if the problem still occured to send it back. within 2weeks they test jumped her saber2 and found the same problem. not only did they lend her a demo while she waited she had her canopy relined and returned in less than 2 weeks. thats customer service Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skymedic 0 #33 June 10, 2003 I'd rather have a canopy that you didn't have to send back to get fixed....even once. Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jurgencamps 0 #34 June 10, 2003 Cfr trim crossfire 1? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhreeZone 20 #35 June 10, 2003 How many mods does that Safire have now Marc? There is'nt a canopy on the market that has'nt had a canopy that was a weird one and would do something unintended. Look at The Safire, Hooknswoop found a way to get more flare out of it and everyone wants theirs modded. The Crossfire trim issue, the Sabre opening hard, the Nova issue, the Vengence openings, the Jedei (how many revisions were made to it?) No one can do so many test jumps on a platform to find every possible tolerence issue and have it addressed before releasing the canopy to the public to become a bigger feedback/improvement market. All it takes is a seam pucker here, a slight miscut there, even a incorrectly bartacked line to severly change how a canopy will open, fly and land. Combine enough little things and you have a whole new canopy.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ramon 0 #36 June 10, 2003 Then don't order anything at all made by Precision. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA."Revolution is an abrupt change in the form of misgovernment.", Ambrose Bierce. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites johnny1488 1 #37 June 11, 2003 hahaha. Nice one! I believe any ram air canopies can have a defect in them. Whether that be funny opeings or a built in turn. I have heard the figure of 1 in 100 thrown around by a few reputable people. Consistantly funny performance is something different. Depends on how the company handles it. I've never jumped a vengeance(but would if I had the chance) but am in love with my new xfire2! Johnny --"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!" Mike Rome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skymedic 0 #38 June 11, 2003 QuoteCfr trim crossfire 1? those would be precision canopies... Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skymedic 0 #39 June 11, 2003 Another thing to remember is that some canopies dont size well...eather up or down...they may be real good at 1.5 on a 135..but suck at 1.5 at 170...and on and on.... and my canopy was fine before I got it moded...now it's just hot roded Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkymonkeyONE 4 #40 June 11, 2003 Marc is totally right in that respect. You know, there are actually thee different Velocites. The upper and lower sizes didn't quite scale right, so they made mods both upways and down until they could sell those other sizes without compromising the median norm. That absolutely does not happen in some canopies. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Professor 0 #41 June 11, 2003 QuoteMarc is totally right in that respect. You know, there are actually thee different Velocites. The upper and lower sizes didn't quite scale right, so they made mods both upways and down until they could sell those other sizes without compromising the median norm. That absolutely does not happen in some canopies. Chuck Where are the cutoffs for that? Do they all fly the same w/ the mods? Ted Like a giddy school girl. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Austin 0 #42 June 11, 2003 Marc, What mod did you have done to your safire?? I jump a Safire 189 and am just curious. Austin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skymedic 0 #43 June 12, 2003 PM sent.... Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jrpayne 0 #44 June 12, 2003 How does the Jedei compare to the Samari and the Vengence in your opinion? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Samurai136 0 #45 June 12, 2003 Think of the differences between a Jedei and Samurai as different model years of Ferrari. Similar but wouldn't you rather have the new model year? I have not jumped a Vengeance but I know a Vengeance pilot who is buying a Samurai as his second canopy. Other pilots I know who have jumped both said, " the Vengeance is a 'dogsled' compared to a Samurai." Ken"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian Ken Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Pablito 0 #46 June 13, 2003 Jedei, I haven't jumped on in a long time but this is what i remember. Really nice dives, flies really nice and is lots of fun. In long spots best way to get back was rear riser than breaks (from upwind). opening tend to be in the fast side but the pocket slider helped a lot also they were on heading 90% of the time. and the flare is a really paticular flare towards the bottom end. Vengance, Dives really nice, flies really nice but it doesn't feel responsive. meaning that when you start the turn is slow but when you are in it you go fast. harness response is slow compared to a samurai same size. It opens really nice but tents to dive one way or another. The flare is sweet (i can't explain that in words) that's why i get further in breaks from long spots up wind. The Samurai is my choice, is responsive in harness, toggles, risers turns. Flies really nice opens really sweet and most of the time on heading and it dives once in a while. the flare is a mixture of a Jedei and a Vengance flare. Really enjoyable. This are my perseptions. Hope it helps. "If you don't overcome your fears they will overcome you first" Shady Monkey/6Segundos Rodriguez/AKA Pablito Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 2 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. 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jsfreefly76 0 #30 June 9, 2003 I got a demo vengence in and put a few jumps on it, but you wanna know what I bought? Crossfire 2! This is my second Crossfire and I love it better than the first. As far as PD's customer service is concerned, I have a really good friend that bought a new sabre 2. His first jump on it, smacked him and broke 2 lines. PD's responce was that it was the containers fault and they wouldn't cover the repair. 1st jump! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #31 June 10, 2003 I find that PD wouldn't take care of that problem very hard to believe. Either your story is lacking some kind of important details, or your friend called the wrong number. PD has an entire section on their factory floor devoted to maintenace and repair, it wouldn't take them a day of labor to get that fixed. Our rigger hadn't ever jumped a Velocity and just bought one. He thought it danced a little too much on opening so he called PD. They sent him a demo to use while they test jumped his canopy and made any necessary changes at no cost. That doesn't sound like a company that would outright deny a repair or investigation for a canopy that someone just bought.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tattoojeff 0 #32 June 10, 2003 your freind must be leaving something out of his story. my girlfreind bought a new saber2. its openings were consitantly slamers so she called pd. they asked her to try a few recomemdations if the problem still occured to send it back. within 2weeks they test jumped her saber2 and found the same problem. not only did they lend her a demo while she waited she had her canopy relined and returned in less than 2 weeks. thats customer service Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #33 June 10, 2003 I'd rather have a canopy that you didn't have to send back to get fixed....even once. Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jurgencamps 0 #34 June 10, 2003 Cfr trim crossfire 1? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #35 June 10, 2003 How many mods does that Safire have now Marc? There is'nt a canopy on the market that has'nt had a canopy that was a weird one and would do something unintended. Look at The Safire, Hooknswoop found a way to get more flare out of it and everyone wants theirs modded. The Crossfire trim issue, the Sabre opening hard, the Nova issue, the Vengence openings, the Jedei (how many revisions were made to it?) No one can do so many test jumps on a platform to find every possible tolerence issue and have it addressed before releasing the canopy to the public to become a bigger feedback/improvement market. All it takes is a seam pucker here, a slight miscut there, even a incorrectly bartacked line to severly change how a canopy will open, fly and land. Combine enough little things and you have a whole new canopy.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ramon 0 #36 June 10, 2003 Then don't order anything at all made by Precision. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA."Revolution is an abrupt change in the form of misgovernment.", Ambrose Bierce. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnny1488 1 #37 June 11, 2003 hahaha. Nice one! I believe any ram air canopies can have a defect in them. Whether that be funny opeings or a built in turn. I have heard the figure of 1 in 100 thrown around by a few reputable people. Consistantly funny performance is something different. Depends on how the company handles it. I've never jumped a vengeance(but would if I had the chance) but am in love with my new xfire2! Johnny --"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!" Mike Rome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #38 June 11, 2003 QuoteCfr trim crossfire 1? those would be precision canopies... Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #39 June 11, 2003 Another thing to remember is that some canopies dont size well...eather up or down...they may be real good at 1.5 on a 135..but suck at 1.5 at 170...and on and on.... and my canopy was fine before I got it moded...now it's just hot roded Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #40 June 11, 2003 Marc is totally right in that respect. You know, there are actually thee different Velocites. The upper and lower sizes didn't quite scale right, so they made mods both upways and down until they could sell those other sizes without compromising the median norm. That absolutely does not happen in some canopies. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Professor 0 #41 June 11, 2003 QuoteMarc is totally right in that respect. You know, there are actually thee different Velocites. The upper and lower sizes didn't quite scale right, so they made mods both upways and down until they could sell those other sizes without compromising the median norm. That absolutely does not happen in some canopies. Chuck Where are the cutoffs for that? Do they all fly the same w/ the mods? Ted Like a giddy school girl. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Austin 0 #42 June 11, 2003 Marc, What mod did you have done to your safire?? I jump a Safire 189 and am just curious. Austin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #43 June 12, 2003 PM sent.... Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jrpayne 0 #44 June 12, 2003 How does the Jedei compare to the Samari and the Vengence in your opinion? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Samurai136 0 #45 June 12, 2003 Think of the differences between a Jedei and Samurai as different model years of Ferrari. Similar but wouldn't you rather have the new model year? I have not jumped a Vengeance but I know a Vengeance pilot who is buying a Samurai as his second canopy. Other pilots I know who have jumped both said, " the Vengeance is a 'dogsled' compared to a Samurai." Ken"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian Ken Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pablito 0 #46 June 13, 2003 Jedei, I haven't jumped on in a long time but this is what i remember. Really nice dives, flies really nice and is lots of fun. In long spots best way to get back was rear riser than breaks (from upwind). opening tend to be in the fast side but the pocket slider helped a lot also they were on heading 90% of the time. and the flare is a really paticular flare towards the bottom end. Vengance, Dives really nice, flies really nice but it doesn't feel responsive. meaning that when you start the turn is slow but when you are in it you go fast. harness response is slow compared to a samurai same size. It opens really nice but tents to dive one way or another. The flare is sweet (i can't explain that in words) that's why i get further in breaks from long spots up wind. The Samurai is my choice, is responsive in harness, toggles, risers turns. Flies really nice opens really sweet and most of the time on heading and it dives once in a while. the flare is a mixture of a Jedei and a Vengance flare. Really enjoyable. This are my perseptions. Hope it helps. "If you don't overcome your fears they will overcome you first" Shady Monkey/6Segundos Rodriguez/AKA Pablito Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
