freeflygoddess 0 #1 August 16, 2003 I know that this is for swooping questions and what not, but I figure who better to ask about downsizing than a bunch of swoopers. So I have about 61 jumps and I have been downsizing pretty quickly, but no trouble with it at all until four weeks ago. Maybe I should start from the begining. I started to downsize from student gear to a 190 right after I got my 20th jump in I did 12 jumps or so on a 190 Sabre 2 with great landings and then went to a spectre 170 which I ate dirt 3 jumps and went back to the store where I was renting and told the owner, she said that a Saber might be better and that she didn't have a 170 Saber but I could try a 150 and I did and it was great. I have had awesome landings on it and I purchased a 135 Saber which is the largest that would fit into my container, however I felt confident enough to buy one and the fact that I could use the gear from the store to demo down was even better. However, a few weeks ago I got caught in the tail end of one of our lovely dust devils at flare time and it slamed me into the ground and I twisted my ankle and hurt my knees, one of which I had surgury on a couple of months ago, but I was really lucky that was all it was and was back the next week to jump. Now at my DZ we have great jumpers, and I am not denying that, and have great advice and all, but ever since that one really bad landing which only one person witnessed and said it was a dust devil that I had hit, everyone and their dog seems to think that I shouldn't jump my gear that I had bought. I have since been having great landings and only one guy there, the only one I would really trust to tell me to not do something or to do it, says I would be fine and he was willing to coach me with my gear and such. However it is really hard to do something in this sport if everyone is discouraging you. I feel confident enough to jump my smaller canopy, which I would have a 1:1 wing loading on, but yet with everyone but one person telling me not to I know will haunt me on my first jump with that gear and god forbid I have to cutaway on that first jump and use my PD 126 reserve would just make those worries even worse. I just would like some opinion from people who don't know me and what they would do. Thanks Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
towerrat 0 #2 August 16, 2003 unfortunately no one here can really answer this for you. The people you jump with are telling you not to, but most of us don't know these people.We also don't know your history as far as canopy control goes. Above and beyond all of that, a 1:1 wing loading is pretty standard for beginning to intermediate pilots. I hate to sound like a jackass, but it sounds like your whole DZ is trying to tell you something. Might I suggest a canopy control course? ------------------------------------------------------Play stupid games, win stupid prizes! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydiven4fun 0 #3 August 17, 2003 You are jumping at a very respectable DZ, And there is a lot a talent there, I would suggest that you listen to what they say. Remember that you can enjoy this sport for years to come and there is no reason to rush things. I was told by an old friend of mine that the secret to this sport is longevity. So don't rush things, You have said that you have a knee injury all ready, I would take it a little slower and at least give your Knee more time to heal completely.Still here after all these years Clayton Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,446 #4 August 17, 2003 Something to think about is that a smaller canopy (like your 135), even loaded at 1.1:1, will be zippier than a bigger one at the same wingloading. It'll swing out farther on turns, too. The lines are shorter, which gives you a different arc. There is a good article on the PD website about this. If a whole bunch of people are telling you something, and your skin is on the line, it might be worth at least taking into consideration. You might be the person who is always lucky until they're really good. But there are a lot more people who are only lucky on most of their jumps. This isn't to say that a 190 is right for you. But a 135 might be better in another 50 jumps, and a 126 is almost certainly too small. And I totally agree with the "canopy control course" idea. That's the best way to progress quickly without mishap. Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflycracker 0 #5 August 17, 2003 In addition to the other advice youve received, also take this into account. If everything goes wrong are you ready to jump the smallest canopy youve ever been under? Not only that. ( I dont know what your student jumps were on) But you should be fully knowledgeable of the fact that F111 DOES NOT land the same as a zero porosity canopy. (I assume PD126R- an F111 canopy). Ive never been to Eloy. But on reputation alone I would think someone has a 126 (or 143 even) reserve you could hook up as your main. If not, I know you can get one from PD. skydiven4fun Brings up an excellent point which Im just realizing after a few hundred jumps. You dont have to do, learn EVERYTHING by your next jump. It wont hurt to wait on that downsize. Unless your planning on quitting soon?! It wont hurt if you decide its best not to hook it in THIS time. Live to downwind the pond another day! for the record- Im not the conservative type(read: DZO points and says "OK dont dont do what that guy is doing"!) Also take into account Im only home because the clubs here stall out at 2:30 and the east side clubs dont pick up until 3:30(burp) And this was a whole lot of typing! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
D22369 0 #6 August 18, 2003 Might I suggest a canopy control course? -->> May I second that motion?? RoyThey say I suffer from insanity.... But I actually enjoy it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #7 August 18, 2003 Agreed. There are some great canopy pilots out there: Jeffro, Dusty, Fruitcake, Steffan, Craig..... It is my understanding that Fruitcake (Jason Peters) and Dusty are running a canopy course now. Drop by and see them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflygoddess 0 #8 August 18, 2003 Well I went out there yesterday and jumped. My gear is all reay, but I wont be able to get it until the first of Sept. anyways, money tree isn't growing yet...Any ways, I do plan on geting coaching from Dusty, he is one of the only guys out there that I trust his opinion on. Jeffro is gone and I don't know those other guys. My jumps were awesome yesterday, I only got to make two, because of how backed up they got. I had manifested for a third, but the call was an hour and 20 min, and by the time the load was to go up, I saw two of our dust devils running around, so I scratched, still hate those things. My landings yesterday were awesome, thanks to some help from Dusty last weekend. Infact I landed ten from from my nice little target that someone had put in out less crowded alt. landing area. Any ways, thanks for all of the advice, and hopefully it help some others out as well. After I get my gear from my local friendly rigger I will let you know how my landings were. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scottjaco 0 #9 August 22, 2003 Please read my post in the Incidents section... "my broken fibula at Perris". If you still want to downsize, its totally up to you. If you want to downsize, the smaller canapies are a lot of fun but are unforgiving. scott Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #10 August 22, 2003 Quoteeveryone and their dog seems to think that I shouldn't jump my gear that I had bought. QuoteHowever it is really hard to do something in this sport if everyone is discouraging you. Well if you don't listen to the people on the DZ why ask here? I know why you are "shopping" for the answer you want. People do this all the time..They ask around till they get the answer they WANT to hear...Then they feel justified. Well I think you will not find it here, and in no way from me. Quote I feel confident enough to jump my smaller canopy, which I would have a 1:1 wing loading on, but yet with everyone but one person telling me not to I know will haunt me on my first jump with that gear and god forbid I have to cutaway on that first jump Just because you feel fine with it...Does not mean you are.. And imagine the shit you will get if you get hurt under it? Sounds to me the smart thing to do would be to listen to the ALMOST entire DZ.... But what do I know?"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,446 #11 August 23, 2003 Quotehe is one of the only guys out there that I trust his opinion on. Jeffro is gone and I don't know those other guys. Chuck Blue, a nationally-known canopy dude, gave you some recommendations. Not to be rude, but you have 63 jumps. You may not have been around quite long enough to know all of the people who know enough more than you to contribute to your canopy education. I'd take Chuck's recommendation any day, and I have about 1200 jumps. This doesn't mean you don't exercise your own judgement, you're just taking advantage of stuff that other people have learned. Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
andy2 0 #12 August 23, 2003 I second that, wendy. Chuck's (SkyMonkeyOne) advice is consistently good and he offers it whenever he can. As a beginner we'd do well to listen to people like Chuck when they talk to us about our skydiving. There's a lot you can learn yourself in this wonderful sport, but also just as great is the knowledge that experienced skydivers can pass onto us. blue skies Andy --------------------------------------------- let my inspiration flow, in token rhyme suggesting rhythm... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ptwob231 0 #13 August 25, 2003 i still and will always maintain that if you aren't sure then you aren't ready. take the advice of those around you but ultimately if you are the slightest bit unsure then you don't have the confidence and therefore, probably lack the skill for a faster canopy. if you can't see it in your mind you'll never be able to do it Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lazyfrog 0 #14 August 25, 2003 I got my sabre 1 150 when I had 60 jumps, I weigh 75KG naked... at first I thought it was great to fly , quick, flare power etc... After 10 jumps I got bored... It was a tractor... Felt very confident on it. Wanted to downsize. Then I took the canopy course in Empuria with Reinier, started to learn how to fly it... my tractor was catching speed... Finished the course a few months later and passed to another step... Crosswind, 90 degrees and final on front risers... WOOOOOOOOW... the tractor can be a racing machine... Before downsizing too quick, I suggest to learn how to use much more your canopy...---------- Fumer tue, péter pue ------------- ourson #10, Mosquito Uno, CBT 579 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
