SkydiveNFlorida 0 #1 September 3, 2003 Looks like so much fun! I just started jumping 6 weeks ago, just go my A license, so I know I obviously can't expect to be a swooper anytime soon, but it sure is something to look forward to! I just downsized to a 170sf canopy and i'm hoping to buy something maybe by Christmas and put a 150sf in it. I would like to stay on a 150sf for a while until I can really fly it well. How long until you started swooping? I would like to take canopy control classes with Scott Miller in Deland soon. How often do you recommend taking canopy control courses? Is now a good time to start? (I only have 25 jumps, but I don't think i'm learning too much by myself). Any other tips? Anything I can try on my canopy that will be new and exciting? thx! Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 0 #2 September 3, 2003 QuoteI would like to take canopy control classes with Scott Miller in Deland soon. This is a good start. QuoteHow often do you recommend taking canopy control courses? Think of Scott as a coach; the more time you spend with your coach, the better you'll become. - Jim"Like" - The modern day comma Good bye, my friends. You are missed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fast 0 #3 September 3, 2003 As many other people have probally said in the past, Scott is a really great coach. He just spent the weekend at my home DZ running a couple advanced classes, and a novice class. He has lots of good information to share at all experience levels.~D Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me. Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymama 37 #4 September 3, 2003 QuoteIs now a good time to start? Now is the perfect time to start, you will learn so much about flying your canopy, landing it and accuracy.She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man, because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ramon 0 #5 September 3, 2003 Canopy coaching is good. concentrate on landing pattern and accuracy. If you are serious you will make a couple of jumps (I do this on a regular basis) where you will open very high. test every aspect of your canopy (plan the test on the ground..stall point, rear riser flying..etc Scott can help you with that). Really knowing your own and your canopy's capabilities is the first step in safely learning to make it perform. Aside from reading books like high Performance canopy flying by Jeff Sobieski getting help from a good canopy pilot is probably the most important thing. when I was first learning I was lucky enough to have hooknswoop around to watch and critique. bloo skies ramon"Revolution is an abrupt change in the form of misgovernment.", Ambrose Bierce. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnischalke 0 #6 September 3, 2003 My personal experience with canopy was going through AFF with a Pro swooper and being on a semi-elliptical canopy at 1.1:1 by jump #10. I took Scott Miller's canopy course on jumps #36-41. On the same canopy, I did my first double-front landing after receiving adequate instruction at jump #49. I took a high-performance canopy course at Rahlmo's Canopy Skool at jump #66 and started doing 45-degree front riser carves shortly thereafter. Learning emergency procedures is key before bringing riser turns down to actual landings--know what a rear riser, toggle or harness turn will do following a front riser entry if you need to bail, yet continue the turn at a lower desent rate. I progressed through 90s and 120s before downsizing to a Lotus 170 at 1.3:1 at jump #150. I went back to straight-ins, to double fronts, to 45s, to 90s and then 120s. After spending a week with Brian Germain, I did my first 180 carve at around jump #200, switched to a Samurai 170, hop-n-popped it a few times and was doing 180s on it, with a higher entry point. I got my new Samurai 150 about 30 jumps ago (about 80% of those were full-altitude hop-n-pops learning the canopy and doing no-contact/contact CRW). About 10 jumps ago, I started using double fronts to land. About 7 jumps ago (last weekend) I did my first 90 on it. The 120s and 180s will come when they come--I'm not in any hurry, no matter how much I love doing 180s. Speed is like having an un-neutered lion as a pet--It's beautiful and wonderful to have around, but if you fuck up, or he flips out, it will maim you. I am still learning, but I have had a ton of great instruction, usually on a daily basis. My advice to you or anybody wanting to make high-performance landings is to read everything you can find about canopy flight, then, take as many canopy control courses as possible. Work out accuracy and perfect your landing flare. Then, on a regular basis, work with a competent swooper who tends toward the long, carvy entries, rather than the low, snappy hook turns. Do lots of hop-n-pops and make swooping your primary learning objective. It is really hard to focus on nailing killer sitflies or doing 12-point 4-way rw jumps AND working on high-performance landings in the same jump. I suggest you pick one discipline and explore it to it's fullest extent. Wring every bit of performance out of your current canopy before you think about downsizing. As far as new and exciting, dump out the door with a friend with a similar wingloading and do some no-contact CRW. Just fly relative and keep sudden movements to an absolute minimum when flying in close proximity. Dogfight with another canopy. Chase or be chased through the sky using all of the canopy's inputs. Just be safe and have fun and you will learn a ton about that nylon thing above your head some people use just to save their life between each jump. 321... mike Girls only want boyfriends who have great skills--You know, like nunchuk skills, bow-hunting skills, computer-hacking skills. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 235 #7 September 3, 2003 CRW-Dog extraodinaire Jon Sikorsky recommends deploying high with a nerf football in your mouth. Spit it out and try to catch it. That way you're not just saying "Ok now right front riser, ok, now left," you actually have to react to something. Do CRW, great way to learn. Edit to change "best" to "great"."I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #8 September 3, 2003 QuoteCRW-Dog extraodinaire Jon Sikorsky recommends deploying high with a nerf football in your mouth. Spit it out and try to catch it. That way you're not just saying "Ok now right front riser, ok, now left," you actually have to react to something. Sounds like a real fun excercise... I'd make a point to stress to keep altitude aware though.... might be easy to focus to much on the ball (the little one) and loose perspective on the other ball (the one rising up at great speed)Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #9 September 3, 2003 There's been some good advice already tabled here. But I'd also like to mention patience. At around 100 jumps I decided that I wanted to swoop (even though when I started in the sport I said I wasn't interested in the risks involved in swooping). Anyway, that was 300 jumps ago and while I do have a decent swoop for an amateur, I am no where near the abilities of the Advanced let alone Pro swoop tour guys and gals. Swooping as an amateur can be done in a few hundred jumps, but swooping at a high caliber (using a pocket rocket canopy) seems to require thousands of jumps. So patience is a virtue in this ever so fun yet dangerous discipline of skydiving. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 235 #10 September 3, 2003 Found the link for a bit more: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=535336;search_string=search_string;#535336"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks 0 #11 September 3, 2003 QuoteLooks like so much fun! I just started jumping 6 weeks ago, just go my A license, so I know I obviously can't expect to be a swooper anytime soon, but it sure is something to look forward to! I just downsized to a 170sf canopy and i'm hoping to buy something maybe by Christmas and put a 150sf in it. I would like to stay on a 150sf for a while until I can really fly it well. How long until you started swooping? I would like to take canopy control classes with Scott Miller in Deland soon. How often do you recommend taking canopy control courses? Is now a good time to start? (I only have 25 jumps, but I don't think i'm learning too much by myself). Any other tips? Anything I can try on my canopy that will be new and exciting? thx! Angela. the first canopy i ever surfed was a pd 9 cell f11 loaded at .8-1.... so downsizeing isnt necessarily the way to learn.. learn to fly the hell out of what you got then go smaller... you wont regret those steps in 1500 jumps from now Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #12 September 3, 2003 Thanks all! I'm gonna try to get some $ together for canopy ctrl courses and go from there. Maybe pick up that book, too:) Maybe I can find someone willing to do CReW with me in z-hillz, seems to be lots of people willing to take on newbies there:) thx! Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
koopa 0 #13 September 4, 2003 I just took the canopy class this weekend at Perris. Wyat Drewes was my teacher I went from smashing in my landings and over shooting my target. To stand up landings and with in my target by 100 feet. It was a very good learning experience for me. I would recommend a canopy class to all new jumpers. I only have 50 jumps. Just my 2 cents. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #14 September 4, 2003 What did you learn? Care to share some of the methods that caused your improvement? What were you doing wrong before? What were you doing right after? Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Samurai136 0 #15 September 4, 2003 Beyond the actual piloting technique is knowing/ having a specific sight plan for the entire landing pattern. With out a sight plan you have no idea if you will overshoot/ undershoot your intended landing point. Ken"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian Ken Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
koopa 0 #16 September 4, 2003 The most helpful thing was the video taping and the debriefing of my landings. I use to race bmx so my natural instinct is to put my hands out in front of me (reaching as they called it) This was the cause of me having hard landings. I all so still used the 2 stage flare they teach you in aff. I learned to try and make my flare one continues smooth movement. -CK Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #17 September 4, 2003 Hi there! Yeah, I definitely want to take the class! My landings are pretty soft n sweet, but usually I am a last minute target planner. I try to plan ahead, but for some reason, never do it right. I usually come pretty close to target, but there are times i'm way off. I fly in brakes sometimes just to target, rather than doing the planning that I needed to. It works, but shouldn't be necessary if I had planned ahead better. I could definitely benefit from a class. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jib 0 #18 September 4, 2003 You may find reading some of the articles at PD's website helpful. http://www.performancedesigns.com/education.asp -------------------------------------------------- the depth of his depravity sickens me. -- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #19 September 4, 2003 I'll definitely read up there. In the meantime, what is the best canopy ctrl book I can buy? I think one person recommended one book, i'll look back. Does everyone concur? Are there lots of books on this? thx ! Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 0 #20 September 4, 2003 As long as you're reading, you should check out the Big Air Sportz owners manual. It's an all around good read, but I think you'll find it gets especially interesting at around page 29. - Jim"Like" - The modern day comma Good bye, my friends. You are missed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icarusevolution 0 #21 September 11, 2003 Hello All, Craig just took the course and did a great job Evolution Canopy Flight School . Please feel free to e-mail me if you have any questions about the school. My personal e-mail is wyat@icaruscanopies.com or you can ask for me at Perris Valley Skydiving (909) 657-3904 Peace, Wyat Icarus Evolution Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #22 September 11, 2003 QuoteCRW-Dog extraodinaire Jon Sikorsky recommends deploying high with a nerf football in your mouth. Spit it out and try to catch it. That way you're not just saying "Ok now right front riser, ok, now left," you actually have to react to something. a baseball hat works well also."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rdutch 0 #23 September 11, 2003 QuoteQuoteCRW-Dog extraodinaire Jon Sikorsky recommends deploying high with a nerf football in your mouth. Spit it out and try to catch it. That way you're not just saying "Ok now right front riser, ok, now left," you actually have to react to something. a baseball hat works well also. I heard a hat is fun to play with under canopy also. Ray Small and fast what every girl dreams of! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cacophony 0 #24 September 11, 2003 Almost more importantly than knowing what to do when things go correctly is knowing what to do when things don't. I'm trying to get over my broken femur and pelvis from an accident 3 weeks ago because I simply didn't flare! I set up my landing in a bad area and instead of fixing the situation I just rode it out and hoped that it would work out. I froze and didn't see the ground screaming at me at 40 mph. Its really easy to make tiny errors, but getting over them can take a long time. Get as much coaching as possible! I wish that I had a canopy coach. I'm definately going to find one now though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #25 September 11, 2003 I am currently working out scheduling canopy coaching with Scott Miller, hopefully this will be the first wknd of Oct after the swoop meet. So, if you toss a hat that high, you can actually go fast enough to catch it? I think i'll try that. :) thx! Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
