Flying an Icarus saphire2

[plowdirt 0]

i'm going to demo one of these saphire2's, but I did notice at my DZ the other day I didn't see any. ofcourse I will do all the flare, lft,rt turns frnt riser,rear riser turns to get a feel for the canopy, But then there is the landing, I would like to get away with not bustin my ass, so how are the landing flares 1 stage 2 stage? I will be flying a 229, yea its big but I'm 230lbs. And yes I know ask the rigger/instructor.

I'm looking for a dollars worth of 2cent advice. thanks ED

[Jumpmunki 0]

just do your drills at altitude, fly your pattern and fly the canopy relative to the ground.. fly the flare rather than just wopping in some input.

[piisfish 140]

flies and lands very well (at least that is the experience I have with mine, 350-400 jumps on it)

just don't be surprised by the opening, it should be very smooth and long. Normally no brutallity at all. Fly the opening with your harness if it came to turn on opening (if you understand what I mean by that)

Have fun and be safe. It's a very sweet canopy.

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[Spizzzarko 0]

You speak of a 1 staged or a 2 staged flare. I posted something about this a long time ago. Please read and head:


I think when people are talking about staged flares they are just passing on bad information! Think of it this way. in it's simplist form there are 3 areas to a landing.

1. Approach
2. Plane out
3. stopping

To transition from your approach to plane out you need to give input to the canopy wether it be toggles or rears. Now do you stop from there? NO. You have to give more input to the canopy to transition from plane out to stopping correct? Now I'm going to introduce a little bit more of a radical concept here, so everyone take a second and catch your breath.....


Let's first of all get rid of this concept of a two or three staged flare. You don't come in flare halfway, stop, and then flare the rest of the way do you? If so you are doing it wrong. Does that method work? Yes, sometimes, but we are a little more advanced than that, aren't we? I believed this concept was brought about by the ld timers who were transitioning from F-111 to ZEPO canopy's. They used this when their canopy's would ballon up when they flared all the way like they were used to with their F-111's.
Let's take the three area's that I spoke of earlier and make them into just one.

1. Landing

You need to start thinking this way because, when you are transitioning to smaller faster canopy's, landing doesn't just happen when your altitude reaches zero. Many of the high speed low drag dudes here will probably agree with me that landing for them starts just after they get everything stowed away after opening. Watch them, and talk to them, and you will soon see that every manuever they make is to set up for landing. There's really no more "Playing Around" when you get to small canopy's. Now let's get back to Landing. Your approach flare and stopping should all be one smooth movement. Only flare as much as you need to, to maintain the altitude above the ground that you want.

Try looking at the horizon during this part of you landing. I want you to standup right now and look at a far door knob or something out your window on the horizon. Now stand on your toes, and then back on your flat feet. Do you see the difference in your sight picture? Now how much have you actually moved? 3 to 4 inches if that.

Now that you have that mastered, think about continuing your flare only as much as you need to, so that your sight picture doesn't change! I told you it was going to get radicle! Now that we are flying flat and level over the gound we eventuall need to stop. Well just keep flaring, and maintaining your sight picture. Eventually you will have flared so much that your canopy will no longer beable to produce the amount of lift required to hold your body in the air. This is usually when you put your feet down on the ground.

I can't tell you how many people I see that don't fly their canopy to it's full potential, and then complain that their canopy doesn't have enough flare to support their fat ass's, and that they need to get a Velocity because it has a more powerfull flare

Learn to flare your canopy all of the way. You should not have to run out your landings very much if you are flaring it correctly, even on low wind to no wind days.

If you change your thought process, and learn to fly your canopy to it's fullest then you will be unstopable!



Think about this when you are flying your safire 2. Good luck and dont do anything stupid like, killing yourself under it.

[BlindBrick 0]

Quote

I will be flying a 229, yea its big but I'm 230lbs.

Nah, I fly a Safire II 269, now that's big. The II is a nice canopy with great flare. Just realize that the flare is strongest at the end of the control stroke,and you'll be fine in that respect.

-Blind

"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it."

[johnny1488 1]

The only thing I can add is to be sure to try out the glide with the rear risers as well as the brakes. Safire's as well as all Icarus canopies tend to do better with glide when you give a little input on the rear risers. I like to push them apart a few inches, easier on the arms.

Good luck and be safe.

Johnny
--"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!"
Mike Rome

[murps2000 86]

I don't know how it flies and lands at the loading you will demo, but my girlfriend had a 129 that she loaded at 1.3, and she hated it. She would get decent landings with some wind, but it just seemed to drop her when she was trying to shut it down in no wind. So I jumped it (at about 1.75:1) and I can tell you that I loved the way it flew and opened, the riser pressure was a dream, and it was fun to swoop, but yes, my girl was right. It just seemed to lack that special something at the end of the flare. It had a great glide, so I don't know if that was the trade off. I wonder if, due to it's camber, the center of lift is slightly more aft on the airfoil than on other canopies, which, with a flat line trim, seems as though it would provide the good glide ratio, but cause stall at low speed. Maybe it is, but that's pure speculation on my part. Anyway, she got a sabre2 120, and loved it. I jumped that, and I like it much better. It seemed to have many of the good qualities of the safire2, but just not the absolute glide ratio. And it has a wonderful, full flare. It also lands quite nicely on rear risers. I hear great things about Aerodyne's pilot, too, which is in the same class.

[plowdirt 0]

Thanks for that lesson, more of a pep talk, but goood. Thanks to the rest of you guys for the replies.

that wing loading will be at 1.0698689 to1.

[Spizzzarko 0]

If you are not properly motivated to do the right thing, then you will do the wrong thing.

[GQ_jumper 4]

I hear great things about Aerodyne's pilot, too, which is in the same class.

[no7rosman 0]

Safire 2 149 - Loading 1.3 - 200 Jumps on it
DZ MSL 4200 ft.

I have experienced the same thing with my canopy. (Not much bottom end flare) It definitely lands better with a bit of speed, and you have to find the sweet spot.

[Pilotmonkey 0]

DAMN good post man- you probably helped quite a few people with the HORIZON line refrence. That is very usefull-NOICE!

Thinkin about chainsaws.......

[piisfish 140]

Quote

Safire 2 149 - Loading 1.3 - 200 Jumps on it
DZ MSL 4200 ft.

I have experienced the same thing with my canopy. (Not much bottom end flare) It definitely lands better with a bit of speed, and you have to find the sweet spot.

err I have a Safire2 139 same WL, 300 jumps on it and my conclusions are it has more flare than other canopies. But if you kill the speed with mid/strong brakes and get to stall the canopy before getting to full brakes, what's wrong is not in teh canopy

Icarus brakes are LOOONG, maybe your arms are too short...

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[Spizzzarko 0]

Thank you.