Tips on Spectre landings?

[timbarrett 0]

I am just about to transition from my Navigator at about 0.85 W/L to a shiny new Spectre at 1.0 W/L.
I would appreciate any tips/hints etc on landing the new canopy. Obviously I will be opening high, experimenting for myself and asking my instructors etc.
For example have read that the flare point for the toggles is lower than some other canopys but as I don't have much experience I was hoping for some advice on this and any other points you might think relevant.

"Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

[FrogNog 1]

Can you recall what your instructors told you about finding the stall point on a canopy, and doing practice flares?

Have your instructors talked to you at all about the possible differences in landing a 7-cell canopy vs. a 9-cell canopy (I think the Navigator is a 9-cell...)?

-=-=-=-=-
Pull.

[FrogNog 1]

(P.S. I'm not jumping a spectre anymore. I need to change my avatar. :)

-=-=-=-=-
Pull.

[DrewGPM 0]

I can't help you much...but you might get some good info by posting this in the Swooping and Canopy Control forum.

good luck and be safe.

[quade 4]

You're going to get a lot of advice here. Be wary of anything that sounds too different than what you're already doing.

I love my Spectres. I have 2700 jumps and about 2600 of them are on Spectres. To date, I have not had a cutaway. They normally open soft and on heading even with pretty average packing. This is not to say that goofy body position or BAD packing won't cause issues, but a lightly loaded Spectre will normally allow you to deal with an inconvienient situation that might be an automatic cutaway situation on a higher loaded 9 cell.

The Spectre lands quite well in a number of different modes from Pro Accuracy to minor swooping. In fact, in the right hands it swoops surprisingly well for a thick-wing, old-school, 7-cell.

My advice on landing one is to NOT stab the brakes as you would with a student canopy and also NOT to perform a "2 stage" flare, but rather simply apply an -appropriately- increasing amount of flare as you get closer to the ground. Continue to apply toggle pressure all the way through and after touchdown and don't forget to run if you have to. Do NOT flap your wings -- you're not a bird.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[pincheck 0]

speak to the instructors or seasoned jumpers who know your skill level Tim. you will probably be asked to do some high level hop and pops with a brief from one of them i doubt your cci will allow you to jump it straight off the bat. Nigel holland is on here you could ask him

Billy-Sonic Haggis Flickr-Fun

[jasonRose 0]

I love my Spectre, she takes good care of me.

I did a ton of research before buying my spectre and I never heard a bad word about spectre. They open nice they fly well and landings are perfect.

You'll love it!!!

Some day I will have the best staff in the world!!!

[AFFI 0]

Ummmmmm, BEER!

[CanuckInUSA 0]

Spectre's are a 7 cell design and will come in steeper than their 9 cell counterparts. But don't let this freak you out. Spectres are great all-around canopies (I have a Spectre 150 for my wingsuit jumps).

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[rasmack 0]

You should read Quade's reply carefully. It hits the mark rather accurately.

[standard newbie disclaimer...]

I fly a Spectre myself at 1.1 (or whatever it is here after christmas
Experiment with the sweet spot. In the beginning you will probably not nail it. You will either have to stab the brakes or you will be cruising along at six feet and feel that you are unable to reach the ground. This is OK. Talk to your instructors and have them comment on your landings (did someone say video? ).

As for the canopy flight, don't be surprised if you can't stall the thing. I have to wrap the steering lines three times around my wrists to get a stall. PD assured me that this was OK.

Have fun...

HF #682, Team Dirty Sanchez #227
“I simply hate, detest, loathe, despise, and abhor redundancy.”
- Not quite Oscar Wilde...

[GravityGirl 0]

Quote

Spectre's are a 7 cell design and will come in steeper than their 9 cell counterparts. But don't let this freak you out. Spectres are great all-around canopies (I have a Spectre 150 for my wingsuit jumps).

Steeper is kind of an intimidating word. I picture the canopy flying nose down to the ground more.

In fact the 7-cell has less "glide" than a 9-cell. It has more "sink". Good for accuracy. Good for landing in a small area. It needs less of a runway to land it.

Find your optimum flare point up high. Fly it. Flare it. You'll do great!

Note: I like to think of the optimum flare point as that spot that sorta lifts you up, but doesn't quite rock you backwards. Just practice a few times up high until you feel that lift... with out that falling back sensation.

Most importantly.... HAVE FUN!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peace and Blue Skies!
Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear!

[Reginald 0]

Read My Signiture Line

"We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP

[tbrown 26]

Quade and Gravity Girl are really telling it like it is, but you still need to get with an instructor.

I might add though, that your Spectre is going to snivel a LOT more than a Navigator. This is normal and it will give you an opening that's like falling slowly into bed (ahhhhh). So don't be alarmed, just remind yourself, "they told me this would happen" and about then the thing should open.

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[squirrel 0]

when i pull, i start counting to ten(i actually scream it in freefall), if i get to 7 and still sniveling, i start to thinking about, (just thinking) EPs. i love the long snivel, makes for some cool video of opeings. smooth openings, super lift for messed up flare timing...its all good.

________________________________
Where is Darwin when you need him?

[Kolla 0]

Hey Tim!

Congrats on your new Spectre - guess you were a good boy this year if thats what Santa brought you!

You can find some really good info on flying & handling the Spectre on our website (http://www.performancedesigns.com/canopyinfo.asp) - click on the Spectre logo for a detailed document on that canopy.

Contrary to a popular belief, the Spectre actually is fairly flat gliding canopy - more so than many 9-cells out there (this info comes from John LeBlanc, the guy that designs PD's canopies).
With the appropriate input, the Spectre offer a wide range of motion, so through the course of the next couple of hundred jumps you can learn a lot from your Spectre (chat with guys like Alastair & Chris Lynch about canopy control - I'm sure they'll have a few tips & tricks for you!).

If you need more info on the canopy or have any questions after you have put a few jumps on it, please don't hesitate to contact us at PD (
support@performancedesigns.com) - we love talking about canopies
Have fun - stay safe!
Blue ones,
Kolla Kolbeinsdottir,
Performance Designs, Inc

Blue Skies Magazine

[peregrinerose 0]

I got a shiny new Spectre 30ish jumps ago. I love it! So glad the rigger at the DZ recommended it, until then I was test jumping Sabre 2s.

Honestly, I haven't had any problems landing it, just takes a little getting used to less of a glide angle, but the advantage is you can land it on a dime pretty easily.

No comment on landing tips, that's for those more experienced than I am

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[nubain1 0]

Quote

I love my Spectre, she takes good care of me.

I did a ton of research before buying my spectre and I never heard a bad word about spectre.
They open nice they fly well and landings are perfect.
You'll love it!!!

I had a bad experiance with a Spectre 230, I was on my check dive for my B lic.
After performing the required manuevers, I got stable and was hanging out and
enjoying the view. After checking my alti and seeing I was at 5k I went to open
(5k is my usual opening alti, I love the canopy ride). On opening I felt a lot of pain and I kinda
greyed out. Lots of pain and hard to breathe and couldn't move my head because line twists
had my chin pinned to my chest. I was able to kick out of the line twists and then could breathe
easier but it still hurt like hell. I looked at my canopy and saw that the bottom skin had ripped
from nose to tail on the 2nd cell on the right side. I tried to do a control check and the right side
would collapse when I pulled on my toggles. Checked my alti and saw I was at around 3.5k
And decided to chop it, had a nice blue PD 218 reserve above my head. After landing, someone
picked up my canopy and free bag and brought it back to the dz. Sent it off to PD since it was a new
canopy and I had only put 30 jumps on it when this happened. Turns out, my opening was so hard that
I had broken a couple of ribs. I was grounded for awhile waiting for PD to check my canopy out and repair it.
They repaired the damage and test jumped it. They said that they could not find anything wrong with it.
Anyway, I've been jumping it since with no problems. Great openings (except that one), nice landings,
and just all around fun canopy. But the point is, even though it is a reliable canopy it can still spank you
and let you know it's there. I love the Spectre and will continue to jump one. It's been my favorite over
the others I've tried.

[shall555 0]

Hiya,

I haven't jumped a Navigator, but on the first jump of my recent re-introduction to the sport I jumped a PD 260. I'm guessing they're similar ( at least, at my exit weight of about 175 ).

The PD 260 was slow and docile and barely changed at flare time -- it just slowed down. I wasn't descending very fast, anyway.

I progressed to a PD 210, which was much faster and had a decent glide.

I finally bought a Sabre 2 190 and jumped that for about 18 jumps before having to have it repaired after a couple of cells were damaged (in the hangar).

The reason I mention all this is to provide a bit of background about the canopies I've jumped just in the past 6 months.

Recently, I've been jumping a borrowed Spectre 190. I like it *very* much. It glides very nicely, even making it back from looong spots at the Eloy boogie -- nearly the last out == long spot. I stood up every landing I made, except my first test jump on the canopy, when I didn't expect the flare to be so powerful -- I popped up about 3 feet.

I found that it really sinks well in deep brakes. I used the sink capability a few times recently when I wound up fairly close to the landing area and still a couple-hundred feet up. It's very stable in that mode and when I let it fly again at 50 feet, was able to flare nicely to a gentle landing.

One of these wouldn't make a bad accuracy canopy, I'm guessing ( though I'm no accuracy hound ).

In general, at my wing-loading and with this canopy, I found that as I reached about 8-10 feet above ground, in full-flight, smoothly and firmly ( not jerkily ) bringing the toggles down to about shoulder level tended to arrest the descent. Then, I would just continue the flare as the speed bled off. It's not a mechanical thing -- you just apply pressure to the brakes as the situation warrants, second-by-second, to keep your feet just above the ground.

Good luck with that Spectre. I've enjoyed the heck out of jumping this borrowed one.

shall

[rasmack 0]

Quote

I haven't jumped a Navigator, but on the first jump of my recent re-introduction to the sport I jumped a PD 260. I'm guessing they're similar ( at least, at my exit weight of about 175 ).

The PD 260 was slow and docile and barely changed at flare time.

Just FYI. The Navigator (contrary to the PD 260) has ZP topskin. This means a lot to the flight and flare of the canopy, so I would not think that the two canopies would compare very well. Of the two I have only flown the Nav, though.

Riggers: Feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

HF #682, Team Dirty Sanchez #227
“I simply hate, detest, loathe, despise, and abhor redundancy.”
- Not quite Oscar Wilde...

[timbarrett 0]

thks..i really appreciate the tips/suggestions

"Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

[TheAnvil 0]

I concur with Quade here, Tim (as I damned well should; he's got many more jumps than I). I think he nails it when he says to continue to apply toggle pressure all the way through after touchdown. Make some practice flares in the air. Practice flat turns and keep your hands off of those front risers below 2000 feet for a couple hundred jumps. Great canopy you've got there - I love mine.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[The111 1]

Quote

Spectre's are a 7 cell design and will come in steeper than their 9 cell counterparts.

As Kolla pointed out, PD says that a Spectre in full flight glides flatter than a Sabre2, for example.

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[garywainwright 0]

Hi Tim,
I have a Spectre and a Velocity and have truly got the best of both Worlds!
Never had a bad opening on my spectre and very few off heading openings. If you jump at Weston ask Andy Ford for some advice or if you ever find yourself at Langar come and look me up. Have a look at the BPAs CH1 & 2 manuals and try the exercises in those.
Chris Lynch and Brian Vacher both run excellent canopy control courses. And if you go to Ampuria for Brians course don't forget to check out Bruno landing his Spectre!

Have fun, be safe,

gary

http://www.garywainwright.co.uk

Instagram gary_wainwright_uk