jambrich 0 #1 April 27, 2007 Does any one know anything about a viper. im thinking about buying one. does it have along dive ,does it have a nice glide?705 252 3005 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2shay 0 #2 April 27, 2007 I own a viper 150 and I think that it is an excellent canopy. If you go to the alpha and space canopy reviews (which is under Atair) one of the last reviews has a lot of details on the viper. It is fully elliptical, and has tons of flare. You could bring it straight in or really swoop the piss out of it. Has very solid and gentle openings. I guarantee, you will be happy with this canopy. edit to add I looked and it is the second review under the alpha. Also forgot to mention that the zp that is used is extremely easy to pack.don't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #3 April 28, 2007 Depending on your experience level and previous canopies the canopy might be a good choice, then again it might be a poor choice if you are transitioning from Student gear to your first rig. What is your previous experience?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deadbug 0 #4 April 28, 2007 I have a ton of jumps on Vipers I owned a 135 and currently own a 120. My current main canopy is a Katana 107, but I can't find it in me to get rid of my last Viper. They are some what similar to a Stiletto, similar dive, similar recovery arc (fairly shallow), but with better openings than a stiletto (less line twist, more on heading openings). I have never needed to chop one. The Viper was marketed in the USA through Sky Depot and the manufacture name on the label is Winchester Technologies, but they were made by Atair the same company that makes the Cobalt. They are made out of the South African ZP Goliver fabric, which is much easier to pack than "PD" ZP. They are fully elliptical and if your considering a noncrossbraced high performance canopy, you can't go wrong. Doug Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cessna54tango 0 #5 April 28, 2007 we have a bunch of them at the dz. they are such good canopies that no one wants to get rid of them as previously mentioned. we just keep rotating them around. we have my old 120, a 135 and a 150 as well as two alpha 99s and a 94. the 120 and the alphas have hma lines and the h-mod but the other 2 are stock. they all fly great, one guy uses the 94 for his wingsuit canopy. also no one mentioned that they are made out of a packer friendly fabric. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Danger 0 #6 April 30, 2007 Like others I am not willing to give up my Viper. Great canopy, with the softest openings I have had. If you're jumping in Southern Ontario, I can lend you my 120 to try. Danger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jambrich 0 #7 May 5, 2007 I was flying a sabre 2 170 now im on the viper 150. my wingloading is just a bit over 1.5. I weight 225 then add my gear so i figure my exit weight is around 235. Some people said i was crazy for the jump. And i thought well what the hell lets try it out and yup very fast, it started seeking and diving on me right off the hop. But im managing, I am not really playing around with the risers. I am just flying her straight in. But i am getting more and more excited to fly her some more I think i will have this canopy for some time. The canpy it's self is in great shape it was just relined. No one knows just how many jumps are on it but i got a great deal on it even though it had some pink in it...lol I was going to buy a kat 150 but there arnt that many old Katana 150's and there not that cheap. also i think so many people belive that P.D. is the number one company out there when there's so many other great canopies to try. Anyways back to the main point, im glad I bought this viper and i cant wait intill my skill level goes up and im able to swoop her.705 252 3005 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cessna54tango 0 #8 May 5, 2007 even though it had some pink in it............ haha, they did make some gay colored stock ones didnt they? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2shay 0 #9 May 5, 2007 my WL was a bit shy of that and now is higher than that because of weightlifting. Anyway the viper is absolutely a great canopy you can do whatever you want w it. straight in swoop whatever. I reccomend that you put hundreds if not a 1000 jumps on that WL although I do not know your experience level. But the viper is an excelent skill builder canopy. very aggressive if you want or very docile if you want. sweeeeeeeeeet. safe swoops Joeldon't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jambrich 0 #10 May 6, 2007 Yeah I jumped it again today and well I only have a few jumps on her. And i have not stood one of them up yet. But im not doing anything stupid with her close in. I cant belive how fast it turns but then again im comparing to a sabre2 170. But im pretty excited to keep on trying and learning as much as I can off this canopy. One of the guys at my dz told me that the new lin set on her is a colbalt linset. it was something like taht not to sure what he means but im still learning so. Oh and I was also wondering does the viper have a long dive, i have not really touched my risers all that much im just many focuaing on landing her stright in thanks guys for the poistive feed back, i am glad i bought a good canopy705 252 3005 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deadbug 0 #11 May 6, 2007 Jambrich, The Viper has a shallow recovery arc much like the Stiletto. Be careful and have fun. Doug Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2shay 0 #12 May 6, 2007 agreed its short but not as short as stilletto. It is an excellent canopy to learn to do hp landings and way way more, I have out performed guys on other hotter canopies. You will love it. Absolutely once again put at least 800-1000 jumps on it, and your skill will be second to none with proper training,don't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
P-dro 0 #13 May 6, 2007 From you post : Quote And i have not stood one of them up yet. But im not doing anything stupid with her close in. I cant belive how fast it turns but then again im comparing to a sabre2 170. But im pretty excited to keep on trying and learning as much as I can off this canopy I would say you shouldn't be under it right now. If you can not even land it properly under good condition, what will happen when someone cuts you off on final? When you will have to land in a backyard, because of a bad spot? What will happen when you do a mistake (and you will)? You'd be better off under a Sabre 2 150 and you'd learn as fast if not faster but with a much more comfortable security margin. Walk away from this canopy while you still can. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2shay 0 #14 May 6, 2007 Give PD a call and ask for Isaiah. He can give you all the info you need for jump #'s/skill/canopies you should be using.don't try your bullshit with me!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #15 May 7, 2007 Quote I would say you shouldn't be under it right now. If you can not even land it properly under good condition, what will happen when someone cuts you off on final? When you will have to land in a backyard, because of a bad spot? What will happen when you do a mistake (and you will)? Do you know him? Have you seen him flying? What is your expert opinion based on? Any of those faults can be made with even a Sabre2... Quote You'd be better off under a Sabre 2 150 and you'd learn as fast if not faster but with a much more comfortable security margin. Have you been jumping a Viper? I have not jumped either. Have you jumped something similar like Contrail or Cobalt? I jump a Cobalt and I'd highly recommend it to anyone with over e.g. 200 jump under WL 1.4, its opening nice, flying great and landing great. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deadbug 0 #16 May 7, 2007 If you jump a Cobalt you have jumped a Viper. Cobalt Alpha and Viper are the same planform with slightly different line trim and MINOR construction tweeks. I own two Vipers and have jumped them all. Doug Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
P-dro 0 #17 May 7, 2007 Quote Do you know him? Have you seen him flying? What is your expert opinion based on? My on opinion is based on the information he gave us: Quote And i have not stood one of them up yet. Doesn't this phrase bother you? at least a little? and when I read Quote The Viper flies like a modern 9 cell fully elliptical canopy like the Crossfire 2 or even the Katana I think if he wants to stay under a 150, a Sabre 2 would be safer, especially with a WL around 1.6... I would even say that he could have stayed with his Sabre2 170 longer and still learn an awful lot... But it was just my point of view... Sorry if I upset you Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #18 May 8, 2007 Quote Quote Do you know him? Have you seen him flying? What is your expert opinion based on? My on opinion is based on the information he gave us: Quote And i have not stood one of them up yet. Have you ever had any 2nd class landing? Has anyone told you that you have to upsize ASAP ? Quote Doesn't this phrase bother you? at least a little? and when I read Quote The Viper flies like a modern 9 cell fully elliptical canopy like the Crossfire 2 or even the Katana Oh yeah, just like Cobalt and Space. Eh Scape is even a student canopy. I'm sorry, I have not tried Katana or Crossfire2. Quote I think if he wants to stay under a 150, a Sabre 2 would be safer, especially with a WL around 1.6... I would even say that he could have stayed with his Sabre2 170 longer and still learn an awful lot... But it was just my point of view... Sorry if I upset you Quote Well, Is a PD Navigator a safe canopy? I broke my ankle with that. So that is all about being safe. I'm not upset, do not worry about that part. You answer is missing about jumping Contrail, Cobalt or Viper. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
P-dro 0 #19 May 8, 2007 Quote Have you ever had any 2nd class landing? Has anyone told you that you have to upsize ASAP ? Yes 2 : one at 18 jumps and one at 140, and I still stood up the last one after rubbing my knees. That's why I am concerned for him. Quote I'm sorry, I have not tried Katana or Crossfire2. They are very aggressive canopies, very fun to fly, but they can be nasty if you're not on top of your game. One of my friend has badly messed up his ankle with has katana, although he thought he was doing fine with it until that accident, even if I told him that his choice was a bit ambitious. But it culd have been far worse. Quote You answer is missing about jumping Contrail, Cobalt or Viper. Never jumped, because they are very rare in France, and technically I'm not there yet. Plus, i'm a chicken Joke aside, I'm not trying to lecture him, I just think he is putting himself at risk by downsizing and changing planform at the same time. And the fact that he isn't able to stand up the landing in good conditions (which is for me the bare minimum) worries me when he'll have to face a dicey situation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #20 May 8, 2007 Quote Quote I'm sorry, I have not tried Katana or Crossfire2. They are very aggressive canopies, very fun to fly, but they can be nasty if you're not on top of your game. One of my friend has badly messed up his ankle with has katana, although he thought he was doing fine with it until that accident, even if I told him that his choice was a bit ambitious. But it culd have been far worse. So, none of us have jumped those. I don't have any opinion about them...... Is telling the marketing material an opinion? Quote Quote You answer is missing about jumping Contrail, Cobalt or Viper. Never jumped, because they are very rare in France, and technically I'm not there yet. Plus, i'm a chicken Joke aside, I'm not trying to lecture him, I just think he is putting himself at risk by downsizing and changing planform at the same time. AFAIK Space, Alpha and Cobalt has the same planform. Now What? How about Firebolt? I would say: it depends... I had some jumps on a similar sized Vison, before I started jumping my Cobalt. They are completely different animals. Quote And the fact that he isn't able to stand up the landing in good conditions (which is for me the bare minimum) worries me when he'll have to face a dicey situation. I guess you would use and learn your new wing in good conditions too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,489 #21 May 8, 2007 QuoteHave you ever had any 2nd class landing? Has anyone told you that you have to upsize ASAP [Wink]? If I downsized to a new, more agressive canopy and I couldn't stand up a simple straight in landing on it then you fucking bet I would upsize again! That's just basic common sense. Look at the info you've got - the guy writes like someone with very low jump No's, he's loading a canopy at 1.5, he hasn't stood it up yet and the people that know him told him he was crazy for downsizing so far. I really don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that this guy should probably be back on a larger canopy for a while.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spoons 0 #22 May 8, 2007 Quotemy wingloading is just a bit over 1.5. I weight 225 then add my gear so i figure my exit weight is around 235. Adding 10lbs isn't enough for gear, it's more like 25lbs so your exit weight is around 250lbs. This means your wingloading is probably more like 1.67... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ianmdrennan 2 #23 May 8, 2007 QuoteI weight 225 then add my gear so i figure my exit weight is around 235 Put all your skydiving gear on (helmet, alti, everything). Get a scale and weigh yourself. You'll probably be surprised at what your exit weight is. Blues, IanPerformance Designs Factory Team Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
