recovery arc sabre 2 vs pilot

[caldefly 0]

I am planning on buying a new canopy that i will be using specially for wingsuit jumps. I have been jumping a sabre 2 and have about 150 jumps with a 120 sq ft. Does any body knows how it compares the recovery arc of a similar size sabre 2 with an aerodyne Pilot. I want to choose the canopy with the longer recovery arc. Thanks

" THE SKY IS THE LIMIT "

[surfbum5412 0]

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I am planning on buying a new canopy that i will be using specially for wingsuit jumps. I have been jumping a sabre 2 and have about 150 jumps with a 120 sq ft. Does any body knows how it compares the recovery arc of a similar size sabre 2 with an aerodyne Pilot. I want to choose the canopy with the longer recovery arc. Thanks

Pilot has a shorter recovery arc

[AggieDave 6]

Why not take a look at the PD Storm. Its a newer 7 cell from PD that you would probably enjoy if you enjoy the performance of a Sabre2 but want something a little more stable.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

I would not make that recommendation. A Sabre 2 in the right hands is a FAR more HP canopy which still exhibits fantastic opening characteristics. While a Pilot might have a slightly different recovery arc than the Sabre2, the main differences to me are in the bottom end power. A Pilot opens just slightly better than a Sabre2, but the Sabre2 has a much more powerful bottom end in my experience. FWIW I jump a Sabre2 97 loaded at about 1.8 with an RDS and HMA lines nowadays.


Chuck

[AggieDave 6]

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A Sabre 2 in the right hands is a FAR more HP canopy which still exhibits fantastic opening characteristics.

While I don't completely disagree with that, I think the Storm would be worth a try for a solid canopy that is fun to fly. This is from a die hard Sabre2 fan.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[caldefly 0]

thanks for the info.... i made 9 jumps with a storm 135 and event though is agreat canopy i am looking for a canopy with more performance . i will be getting me a sabre 2 107. I am only 145 pounds so the wing loading is still reasonable while i have some room for advancing my hp landings. thanks again

" THE SKY IS THE LIMIT "

[loumeinhart 0]

I fly a sabre2 loaded at 1.7 and it scares the jesus out of me. I am doing 180's plus or minus depending on the setup. She is solid in both regular flight and the turn. The recovery arc is somewhat flyable and I'm having a blast swooping it. This is my .02 but I've never jumped a Pilot.

[JohanW 0]

[gets popcorn - settles in] This oughta be good.

Johan.
I am. I think.

[surfbum5412 0]

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[gets popcorn - settles in] This oughta be good.

What? Are you watching American Idol or something?

[Blink 1]

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I fly a sabre2 loaded at 1.7 and it scares the jesus out of me.

That is what he is watching. 1.7 WL at 450 jumps...and his canopy scares him.

[JohanW 0]

We don't get that here.
I counted four statements of a questionable nature in the post I replied to. In two lines of text. I was impressed.

wingload 1.7 at 450 jumps
"it scares the jesus out of me"
180s - generally regarded as more difficult and less safe than 90s or 270
"the recovery arc is somewhat flyable" (I may be reading this wrong)

Johan.
I am. I think.

[ruudwas 0]

maybe Lou should start his own thread...his post cries for response...

Mine would be get a bigger Sabre2 that does not scare you...

[surfbum5412 0]

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We don't get that here.
I counted four statements of a questionable nature in the post I replied to. In two lines of text. I was impressed.

wingload 1.7 at 450 jumps
"it scares the jesus out of me"
180s - generally regarded as more difficult and less safe than 90s or 270
"the recovery arc is somewhat flyable" (I may be reading this wrong)

At the level of jumps he's at, Loumeinhart can fly a x-braced if he wants.

At 500 jumps, a 1.7 WL on a Sabre2, busting 180's on approach is not reckless, assuming that he is competent. Agree that 180's are not smart.

[JohanW 0]

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At the level of jumps he's at, Loumeinhart can fly a x-braced if he wants.

Another thing we don't get here. Not saying that's good or bad. (Have to have a 1000 jumps to fly XB in NL.)

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At 500 450 jumps, a 1.7 WL on a Sabre2, busting 180's on approach is not reckless, assuming that he is competent.

If it's not a problem, it's not a problem. I (heart) the reasoning here.

Goodness, I have to work at enjoying the popcorn this time.

Johan.
I am. I think.

[billvon 3,073]

I'd also check out the Safire2. Longer arc than the Sabre2 and very well behaved.

[Pendragon 1]

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I'd also check out the Safire2. Longer arc than the Sabre2 and very well behaved.

I'd second that. I use a Safire2 129 @ 1.6 for wingsuit flights and it is very well behaved. Swoops good too for me, and is resposive on the rears coming out of a 270 turn. It's also fun to out "swoop" some other jumpers using higher-loaded fully elliptical canopies. But like any canopy, you can kill yourself on it.

(I also jump a Crossfire2 and Velocity)

--
BASE #1182
Muff #3573
PFI #52; UK WSI #13

[rhanold 0]

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At the level of jumps he's at, Loumeinhart can fly a x-braced if he wants.

At 500 jumps, a 1.7 WL on a Sabre2, busting 180's on approach is not reckless, assuming that he is competent. Agree that 180's are not smart.

Hey Dingle Berry, I got to ask, How do you know Loumeinhart's skill level? If I were to give an endoresement of someone elses canopy skills I would not have to assume he was competent.

To the OP, I have jumped multiple sizes of pilots and Saber2s and the recovery arc for saber2s allways seemed longer.

[LetsGoOutside 0]

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i will be getting me a sabre 2 107. I am only 145 pounds so the wing loading is still reasonable while

I jumped exactly this canopy with a wingsuit over 300 times loaded around 1.8. Nothing but a great experience. I fly a Katana 97 with my wingsuit now and also nothing but great (but I've got 700 - 800 wingsuit jumps so my deployments are dialed). Even the times where I have had line twists, spinning never occurred.

[surfbum5412 0]

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At the level of jumps he's at, Loumeinhart can fly a x-braced if he wants.

At 500 jumps, a 1.7 WL on a Sabre2, busting 180's on approach is not reckless, assuming that he is competent. Agree that 180's are not smart.

Hey Dingle Berry, I got to ask, How do you know Loumeinhart's skill level? If I were to give an endoresement of someone elses canopy skills I would not have to assume he was competent.

To the OP, I have jumped multiple sizes of pilots and Saber2s and the recovery arc for saber2s allways seemed longer.

What are you talking about, bro? I never said I did know, I am only assuming. And assuming that he is competent, those numbers (jumps/WL/swooping) are conforming to canopy progression trends. I am not taking a stance on where it lies on the safety continuum, I am only giving an observation.

And if my "assumption" about him being competent is wrong, then the above is thrown out the window.

Are you serious??

[ianmdrennan 2]

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I'd also check out the Safire2. Longer arc than the Sabre2 and very well behaved.

I wouldn't agree that it has a longer arc at all.

Still, it definitely bears exploration (any canopy really).

Find what fits your tastes, and needs.

Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[linebckr83 3]

Why do you have an attitude every time you respond to someone? He was simply asking you how you know he is competent, because you assumed it.

I know people who have 450 jumps, claim they can swoop by toggle whipping 180's, and are dying to jump at that WL. Does that mean they are competent just because they claim to be? So if he is anything like these people, he is definitely reckless. If not, then great and I'm glad he is progressing safely.

On the original topic, I have jumped both and the Sabre2 arc is definitely longer. I did not mind my Pilots recovery, and I prefer its openings fo sho! But if you want a longer arc between those 2, the sabre is the way to go.

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

[LetsGoOutside 0]

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I'd also check out the Safire2. Longer arc than the Sabre2 and very well behaved.

I wouldn't agree that it has a longer arc at all.

Backing this up having jumped both around the same size. Safire 2 is much less a swooper than the Sabre2. Good all around canopy still, though.

[surfbum5412 0]

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Why do you have an attitude every time you respond to someone? He was simply asking you how you know he is competent, because you assumed it.

I know people who have 450 jumps, claim they can swoop by toggle whipping 180's, and are dying to jump at that WL. Does that mean they are competent just because they claim to be? So if he is anything like these people, he is definitely reckless. If not, then great and I'm glad he is progressing safely.

On the original topic, I have jumped both and the Sabre2 arc is definitely longer. I did not mind my Pilots recovery, and I prefer its openings fo sho! But if you want a longer arc between those 2, the sabre is the way to go.

"Does that mean they are competent just because they claim to be?"

You're totally missing the point man. I'll rephrase...in general, assuming that someone is a current and competent canopy pilot, those numbers (WL/canopy/swooping) are not uncommon to see, and according to a lot of people, are not considered reckless. This is not saying how safe it is, it's only an observation of trends.

How would I know if he's competent? I'm only assuming that he is. And if he isn't, forget everything I said regarding him. Geeez.

And don't take it personally, I love to argue. We'd have tons of fun on jumps.

[linebckr83 3]

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And don't take it personally, I love to argue. We'd have tons of fun on jumps.

The funnel would definitely be YOUR fault!

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

[loumeinhart 0]

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maybe Lou should start his own thread...his post cries for response...

Don't let me get your panties bunched up. I threw in my .02 on the sabre2 recovery arc. If you don't like what I said then you and the other guy from the Netherlands don't ever have to jump with me.