Enrique 0 #1 January 23, 2003 What do you think about having one or two "fire & forget it" exits down and ready for competitions instead of learning how to launch the entire dive pool? BTW - It's not being lazy, it's minimizing the "funnel factor" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #2 January 23, 2003 I would say it depends on your skill level. I -know- that there have been teams that have used this strategy to good advantage in the lower skill levels, but like almost any decision, it's a trade-off. In this case it's a tradeoff between how much time, on average, you'd take to get to a scorable first point versus how much time you'd lose, on average, if the exit funneled. Not really certain where that point is though.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Enrique 0 #3 January 23, 2003 QuoteI would say it depends on your skill level.*** To say the least! My team looks at it this way: we rather use 2-3 seconds to transition to the first point, than to risk 10-15 +/- to recover from a funnel. Also, to learn soooo many different exits you pretty much need to live on the DZ and be sponsored (i.e., not my case). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 4 #4 January 23, 2003 Well, it's not really the transition time you need to look at but rather the exit to first point, if you can get that first point within two to three seconds of exit, then you should -probably- move on to exiting the first point!My -guess- is that your exit to first point is probably a LOT longer than 2 to 3 seconds if you're using this strategy.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Enrique 0 #5 January 23, 2003 but rather the exit to first point*** I think that's what I mean. We normally launch E or O and those work out pretty well from the beginning. If we're solid the first couple of seconds, we will transition to the first point. Make sense? (Sorry, I guess there is a little language barrier here) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Albatross 0 #6 January 23, 2003 Quade is right. In the begining it is a good idea to get a few basic exits down so that you can launch them (meeker, sidebody, staristep dimond). Then you can trasition to the first formation. If you have limited time and experience then this is a great method. But taking a shot at launching the formations intact is also a good idea. Some will work with your group and some will be difficult. Once you have a few that you can launch you can always go back and launch what you are good at in competition.Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites weid14 0 #7 January 23, 2003 Quotebut rather the exit to first point*** I think that's what I mean. We normally launch E or O and those work out pretty well from the beginning. If we're solid the first couple of seconds, we will transition to the first point. Make sense? (Sorry, I guess there is a little language barrier here) if you can launch an "E" or an "O" without spinning down the hill -- you can launch every formation, esp if you are training the smaller dive pool. no need to live at the DZ or make a gazzillion jumps. lots' of mock exits help though. basically each position has the same basic exit techinque 80% of the time, (tail dropping low, OC presenting straight out, point going up, and IC squeezing by the door getting even with the OC. -- its simplistic, but really people make it way more compicated than necessary). the trick is knowing where to go on the hill and putting yourself there, without upseting anyone elses body position/presentation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #8 January 23, 2003 Not a bad idea, a lot of teams use it. But you will find that if you can exit together with the proper timing, and presentation, most exits launch close to the same. However, some people "cheat" the exit a little. Meker launch can quickly turn into: Meker Donut Snowflake Adder Buddies Bipole Cat 360 Cat Zig marq Sidebody can turn into: Unipod Monopod Murphy Hook Bundy Crank Catacord ECT.... A Diamond is easy to launch and can be: Diamond Open accordian Buddies Ect.... A good way to start, but try the other exits...some are just as easy. Unipod is easy, Bow is easy..ect...Try them Ron"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mjasantos 0 #9 January 24, 2003 Enrique, A 4-Way FS Team should be the best learning tool! Being so, your team should focus on the learning and not on the score... after you've learned both as a team and individually, then you can think about the score... but even then, you should be open minded to learn all the time about the best and fastest way to perform in 4-Way Formation Skydiving. If from the earlier learning stages you limit too much your "dive pool", both on launchings or performance at terminal, later when you need it, it won't happen because you are just used to a few small moves or launchs... You'll find that, sometimes and depending on team experience level, there are several types of launching for a specific random or block, but that is quite different from what you're suggesting about "fire & forget" exits... You should learn FS using the correct path, not a "vicious" one... The more you and your team are looking forward to learn, the better you'll be as skydivers and as a FS Team. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
quade 4 #4 January 23, 2003 Well, it's not really the transition time you need to look at but rather the exit to first point, if you can get that first point within two to three seconds of exit, then you should -probably- move on to exiting the first point!My -guess- is that your exit to first point is probably a LOT longer than 2 to 3 seconds if you're using this strategy.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Enrique 0 #5 January 23, 2003 but rather the exit to first point*** I think that's what I mean. We normally launch E or O and those work out pretty well from the beginning. If we're solid the first couple of seconds, we will transition to the first point. Make sense? (Sorry, I guess there is a little language barrier here) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Albatross 0 #6 January 23, 2003 Quade is right. In the begining it is a good idea to get a few basic exits down so that you can launch them (meeker, sidebody, staristep dimond). Then you can trasition to the first formation. If you have limited time and experience then this is a great method. But taking a shot at launching the formations intact is also a good idea. Some will work with your group and some will be difficult. Once you have a few that you can launch you can always go back and launch what you are good at in competition.Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weid14 0 #7 January 23, 2003 Quotebut rather the exit to first point*** I think that's what I mean. We normally launch E or O and those work out pretty well from the beginning. If we're solid the first couple of seconds, we will transition to the first point. Make sense? (Sorry, I guess there is a little language barrier here) if you can launch an "E" or an "O" without spinning down the hill -- you can launch every formation, esp if you are training the smaller dive pool. no need to live at the DZ or make a gazzillion jumps. lots' of mock exits help though. basically each position has the same basic exit techinque 80% of the time, (tail dropping low, OC presenting straight out, point going up, and IC squeezing by the door getting even with the OC. -- its simplistic, but really people make it way more compicated than necessary). the trick is knowing where to go on the hill and putting yourself there, without upseting anyone elses body position/presentation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #8 January 23, 2003 Not a bad idea, a lot of teams use it. But you will find that if you can exit together with the proper timing, and presentation, most exits launch close to the same. However, some people "cheat" the exit a little. Meker launch can quickly turn into: Meker Donut Snowflake Adder Buddies Bipole Cat 360 Cat Zig marq Sidebody can turn into: Unipod Monopod Murphy Hook Bundy Crank Catacord ECT.... A Diamond is easy to launch and can be: Diamond Open accordian Buddies Ect.... A good way to start, but try the other exits...some are just as easy. Unipod is easy, Bow is easy..ect...Try them Ron"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjasantos 0 #9 January 24, 2003 Enrique, A 4-Way FS Team should be the best learning tool! Being so, your team should focus on the learning and not on the score... after you've learned both as a team and individually, then you can think about the score... but even then, you should be open minded to learn all the time about the best and fastest way to perform in 4-Way Formation Skydiving. If from the earlier learning stages you limit too much your "dive pool", both on launchings or performance at terminal, later when you need it, it won't happen because you are just used to a few small moves or launchs... You'll find that, sometimes and depending on team experience level, there are several types of launching for a specific random or block, but that is quite different from what you're suggesting about "fire & forget" exits... You should learn FS using the correct path, not a "vicious" one... The more you and your team are looking forward to learn, the better you'll be as skydivers and as a FS Team. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
