Deuce 1 #1 September 23, 2002 I just heard about this obvious danger this past weekend. When the TM pulls, and the pair drop through the "trap door" they swing forward at line stretch and can kick the camera flyer in the face. Well, duh. How often does this happen? Since I've been in the sport only a couple of short years, the focus seems to have been on camera helmet entanglement, and unstable deployment danger for camera flyers. Getting whacked by the feet of the TM pair at line-stretch/deployment as a primary danger wasn't something I'd heard of before Saturday. Do any of you have any incidents you can share? Thanks, JP Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #2 September 23, 2002 I've only seen one camera flyer stay at 1 foot out during the pull sequence, he had the tandem fall into him and scared him a lot.. Most at my DZ back off to about 5-6 out to get the bag release and position themself to flip to their knees and back to get the opening shot. On Vector rigs there is a trapdoor, but on Strongs there is not as much of an effect that I've noticed. Most TM's I've jumped with wave the camera flyer off just before they pull, I used that as a cue to back up and have my creative flying come out by either spinning on my knees as they open, do a helicopter in a stand after they are open, a few back flips after they are fully open etc...Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miller 0 #3 September 23, 2002 It's never happened to me, but I will admit it's been close a time or two. It really depends on where you want to be on openening. I've seen some video guys that like to be above the tandem at pull time so the effect of the video guy freefalling past the snivelling tandem pair is dramatic, but IMHO that's about the very worst place you can be. I am no authority, but personally I like to be about two or three feet below the tandem, and at pull time I usually slide slightly to my left, so that I'm just offset from in front of them. This does two things: it allows a good shot of the student pulling (if they actually do), and if their feet do swing out they should miss you to your right. Mike PS.. Deuce, I still owe you some videos, I haven't forgotten. I've just gotten busy, you know...work, nationals, 20 jumps a weekend.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #4 September 23, 2002 I like to back up a few feet. 4-6 is good 3-4 is better....and get slightly off to the side. Roll Head down and then carve underneath them as they pull. It makes cool video...keeps you at a safe distance, and also gets you out from underneath the tandem in case they have a mal. Oh yes...I like to get about 5 Feet high on them before they dump. You get a nice long shot of the snivel plus the TM and occasionally the passenger waving. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pd190 0 #5 September 23, 2002 Deuce... I agree with freeflir29 on how to prepare and film the TM and Pass at pull time. I haven't been kicked, but a few times been close. However, a good friend of mine was kicked right in his chin with the tandem Pass's foot when she wasn't ready for the pull sequence. He was lucky and only caught her toes, but it darn near ripped his helmet off of his head and the vid didn't turn out so well after that. Good lesson learned for me! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YahooLV 0 #6 September 23, 2002 DUH, Back off a couple of feet, and watch out for flying shoes, too! If ya get kicked, you're too close. ...and if a shoes comes at you, get it on film, it's a great video perk!!!!!!http://www.curtisglennphotography.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #7 September 23, 2002 No worries. Yeah, our DZ uses Vectors, and if you're level or just below, where you get good video, they drop about 6 feet below you when they dump. I like to move to the side to see them stand up and accelerate away. I scooted back and stayed out front on Saturday and that's when I had one of the veteran TM's tell me about getting clocked by the feet of a tandem if you're out front and too close. I had just not read about tandem-video collisions before, and it sounded like it was something that happened somewhat more than rarely. I tell you what, I'm digging flying camera. There's always something to do better. Better exit! Get closer! Closer and lower! Orbit! Clown the student! Oh shit, get the sun behind me. What's this thing in my mouth? Oh, crap! Stills! clickclickclickclick! Get paid to skydive? Who'da thunk it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites tommy 0 #8 September 24, 2002 Most of us at our DZ rotate to the right side to catch the ripcord pull then follow (on knees, back, head down, whatever) the tandem open. We all use audible's which helps you know when to expect a pull, but you never really know when the student will pull, so you just have to keep one eye open looking for the unexpected. -Tommy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Pendejo 0 #9 September 24, 2002 I agree with Phree... Our DZ jumps Strongs. But don't be fooled, they still move forward on deployment. I like to pop up and inflate my wings at pull time. I can stay with them for about 3 seconds during the snivel. I was to close once and the only thing that kept me from getting kicked was dumb luck. The tandem student actually saw me as they were coming by and pulled her feet back. It made for a great shot, but was one of the dumbest things I have ever done. You can get just a great shot from 5-6 feet back without getting you head taken off and the tandem student will be just as happy. He who swoops the ditch and doesn't get out buys the beer Pendejo He who swoops the ditch and does not get out buys the BEER!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhreeZone 20 #10 September 24, 2002 Another thing to think about at pull time is the student might have a reflex and tighten up and extend their legs for just a tiny amount of time, but that is all thats needed to drive the tandem forward while the JM is busy pulling. An extra 2 feet might make all the difference then.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites WmLauterbach 0 #11 September 25, 2002 ...there is such a thing as shooting too close Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyPsycho 0 #12 October 2, 2002 sounds like someone needs to back off a bit more on deployment. something i do that i havent seen anyone do (not that there isnt someone else somewhere) is about 5 seconds before deployment, i flip headdown in front of the tandem, and video the deployment on my head. after the snatch slows them down so that im below them i carve under them to a backfly as the canopy opens. makes for a really cool deployment sequence. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites airdrew20012001 0 #13 October 6, 2002 Personally, and this is just me, I never film the deployment sequence from in front for that reason. I like to scoot over to the main deployment handle side to get a shot of the student or TM pulling the rip cord. I have seen other videos where the pair do surge forward and that, along with the teaching feedbakc (after all the first tandem is part of the road to getting off student status), is why I shoot that portion from the main side. Just a thunk!Drewfus McDoofus Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites pullhigh 0 #14 April 22, 2003 Pendejo, if we ever find a DZ that will let us jump toghether again, I'll be dure to tell the passengers not to bend their legs back like that. You have a helmet on, what could go wrong? Your Pal Ganja Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Deuce 1 #15 April 22, 2003 Wow. This is a blast from the past. I was reviewing some of my early tandem video stuff, and I have so much more fine tuning on my distance control. I'd still like to get lower (Vectors) but I never hear the comment "My friend is so much closer in his video"Tandem video is big fun! JP Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JayhawkJumper 0 #16 April 22, 2003 I haven't heard of anyone getting kicked but I did hear one interesting story. I've also seen a lot of videographers move out and up to get the canpoy deploying shot. One of the videographers at our DZ did this and stayed really close and aparently his head ended up inside or really close to a cell of the tandem canopy. All you could see on the vid was fabric. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites garywainwright 0 #17 April 22, 2003 I heard of a cameraguy getting kicked in the throat at pull time by the passenger. The camera guy then went in trying to get his homemade aluminium chin guard out of his throat (at least thats what they think he was struggling with). Happened before i started jumping so i don't have any other details. I back off 5-6 ft then sit then half rotate on my back to get a portrait deployment shot (when i'm lucky - the more i practice the luckier i get!)http://www.garywainwright.co.uk Instagram gary_wainwright_uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Pendejo 0 #18 April 22, 2003 Geez Ganja... Thats kinda harsh... Pendejo He who swoops the ditch and does not get out buys the BEER!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. 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tommy 0 #8 September 24, 2002 Most of us at our DZ rotate to the right side to catch the ripcord pull then follow (on knees, back, head down, whatever) the tandem open. We all use audible's which helps you know when to expect a pull, but you never really know when the student will pull, so you just have to keep one eye open looking for the unexpected. -Tommy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pendejo 0 #9 September 24, 2002 I agree with Phree... Our DZ jumps Strongs. But don't be fooled, they still move forward on deployment. I like to pop up and inflate my wings at pull time. I can stay with them for about 3 seconds during the snivel. I was to close once and the only thing that kept me from getting kicked was dumb luck. The tandem student actually saw me as they were coming by and pulled her feet back. It made for a great shot, but was one of the dumbest things I have ever done. You can get just a great shot from 5-6 feet back without getting you head taken off and the tandem student will be just as happy. He who swoops the ditch and doesn't get out buys the beer Pendejo He who swoops the ditch and does not get out buys the BEER!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #10 September 24, 2002 Another thing to think about at pull time is the student might have a reflex and tighten up and extend their legs for just a tiny amount of time, but that is all thats needed to drive the tandem forward while the JM is busy pulling. An extra 2 feet might make all the difference then.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WmLauterbach 0 #11 September 25, 2002 ...there is such a thing as shooting too close Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyPsycho 0 #12 October 2, 2002 sounds like someone needs to back off a bit more on deployment. something i do that i havent seen anyone do (not that there isnt someone else somewhere) is about 5 seconds before deployment, i flip headdown in front of the tandem, and video the deployment on my head. after the snatch slows them down so that im below them i carve under them to a backfly as the canopy opens. makes for a really cool deployment sequence. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airdrew20012001 0 #13 October 6, 2002 Personally, and this is just me, I never film the deployment sequence from in front for that reason. I like to scoot over to the main deployment handle side to get a shot of the student or TM pulling the rip cord. I have seen other videos where the pair do surge forward and that, along with the teaching feedbakc (after all the first tandem is part of the road to getting off student status), is why I shoot that portion from the main side. Just a thunk!Drewfus McDoofus Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pullhigh 0 #14 April 22, 2003 Pendejo, if we ever find a DZ that will let us jump toghether again, I'll be dure to tell the passengers not to bend their legs back like that. You have a helmet on, what could go wrong? Your Pal Ganja Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #15 April 22, 2003 Wow. This is a blast from the past. I was reviewing some of my early tandem video stuff, and I have so much more fine tuning on my distance control. I'd still like to get lower (Vectors) but I never hear the comment "My friend is so much closer in his video"Tandem video is big fun! JP Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JayhawkJumper 0 #16 April 22, 2003 I haven't heard of anyone getting kicked but I did hear one interesting story. I've also seen a lot of videographers move out and up to get the canpoy deploying shot. One of the videographers at our DZ did this and stayed really close and aparently his head ended up inside or really close to a cell of the tandem canopy. All you could see on the vid was fabric. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
garywainwright 0 #17 April 22, 2003 I heard of a cameraguy getting kicked in the throat at pull time by the passenger. The camera guy then went in trying to get his homemade aluminium chin guard out of his throat (at least thats what they think he was struggling with). Happened before i started jumping so i don't have any other details. I back off 5-6 ft then sit then half rotate on my back to get a portrait deployment shot (when i'm lucky - the more i practice the luckier i get!)http://www.garywainwright.co.uk Instagram gary_wainwright_uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pendejo 0 #18 April 22, 2003 Geez Ganja... Thats kinda harsh... Pendejo He who swoops the ditch and does not get out buys the BEER!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
