340K-sufficient video resolution?

[TEric 0]

Is anyone using a video camera for tandem videos with 340K actual video resolution? I'm wondering if I can get away with a Sony DCR-HC20 that I can pick up relatively cheaply, or if I need to get the HC40 so that I can get 690K res. If I understand correctly, VHS quality tops out at around 220K, so if my tandem vids are to be dubbed to VHS, why would I need more quality?
Thanks
Eric

[newshooter12 0]

teric -
the higher quality the video you start with... the better the VHS dub seems to turn out. I work with Beta SP, Beta SX, DV and DVCAM, let me just say there is a huge difference in quality on VHS when you're making copies. So the more you can start out with the better off you are in the end.
Better yet. don't use the standard composite video out from the camcorder. use the S connector. (assuming you're vcr can accept it.)
matt

[kelpdiver 2]

Where do the extra pixels get dropped off? NTSC is 350k, and both camcorders record to that format. What does the extra 350k gain you in the first step? Better zoom? Better attempt at 16:9? I've never quite got the difference, other than the higher resolution usually comes with a higher min lux rating.

[newshooter12 0]

From what i've seen it's a major reason video quality drops is CHEAP cables and connectors. i don't know how many times i've been to a friends house where they've spent thousands on DVD players, stereo equipment, big TVs and surrounds sound speakers, but refuse to spend a couple bucks on decent cables.
As for why IMO VHS quality is low... the tapes degrade with the oxide falling off quickly over time, people don't store the tapes in a cool dry place, and VHS is meant to be a cheap mass production media.
Back to work for me. Waiting patiently for the XDcams to be put in service!!
Matt

[kelpdiver 2]

Connectors I'll buy, but the difference in cables is pretty meaningless. Spending 10% of a stereo budget on cabling is ridiculous.

VHS is definitely a step down from miniDV - 500 lines down to a few hundred. And consumer VCRs won't even take Svideo in, nevermind firewire.

[newshooter12 0]

if you've got crappy cables with crappy shielding or lower grade connections that equates to signal loss. signal loss works out to being a less spectacular image in the long run.
and about the, "And consumer VCRs won't even take Svideo in, nevermind firewire." A handful of stand alone DVD burners do have varying degrees of firewire capability. Sure your $40 walmart special VCR may not have an S input, but what's the point of having a $500 or $1000 worth of video camera on your head with good resolution when you're going to dump it all down the drain?? IMHO if you're going to go a decent route. not necessarily spending a fortune. I'd take my end result into consideration and tailor the rest to fit that goal.
matt

[newshooter12 0]

10% of the cost of a stereo is a little excessive on your part. A few weeks ago my friends father wanted help connected his home stereo/DVD sys. he had most of the cables that would work well enough, but we decided to get the 2 S-video cables and an optical cable for the 5.1. Something like $35 dollars later and a whole lot less wiring mess as well as time he was very happy with the result. so for about 1.75% of his stereo system we improved the picture and sound quality dramatically.
he was happy... matt

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

and about the, "And consumer VCRs won't even take Svideo in, nevermind firewire." A handful of stand alone DVD burners do have varying degrees of firewire capability. Sure your $40 walmart special VCR may not have an S input,

Matt, how are VCRS and set top DVD burners in the same conversation? One is 40-60$. The Panasonic HS2 I got 2 summers ago ran over $600. Prices has improved a bit, but only a portion of the dvd units have the firewire inputs. I don't think I've ever seen a VCR with svideo in or out. I know it exists on the pro market, but who actually buys those? I barely have a need for tape anymore.

[nacmacfeegle 0]

The only VCRs I have ever seen are SVCRs.
Higher quality recording (still sub-pro level), and worth it in their day, but probably not good value for money compared to modern DVD and HDD recorders now available.

You guys don't use SCART much over there, they are great connection systems.

--------------------

He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson

[newshooter12 0]

what's a SCART?

[newshooter12 0]

you mentioned firewire and the only place they'd be is a DVD burner (aside from a camera or dv deck) in the flow of video production that i've seen at a DZ unless you're into NLE, which is more time consuming for most places than making a dub... that and some people at my DZ are already considering moving to dubbing to DVD instead of or in conjunction with VHS.
I hooked up an older prosumer S-VHS deck to one of the videographer's systems from my DZ. It has S-Video in and out. That may be a good option if you can find some on e-bay. Or floating around somewhere.
here's one similar to what i got for a friend I believe her's was actually the AG-1970 model... only she didn't pay nearly as much:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=21168&item=3850889944&rd=1
A few others:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3319&item=3850917646&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=21168&item=3851048611&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=21168&item=3851212716&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=21166&item=3851232426&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=21168&item=3851379541&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=67830&item=5730753004&rd=1
or just search for Panasonic S-VHS or PANASONIC AG-1960 or [url]PANASONIC AG-1970
matt