Shooting/edting techniques (was CX100 Cage)

[parachutist 2]

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Hey Cookie,

Looks great! Really impressive, not that it's surprising.

One thing you might want to think about is adding a hole in the top for zoom access.

Personally, I like zoom buttons completely blocked off. I've never had a customer complain about lack of zoom in their video... but when it's accidentally zoomed in and you didn't know it... refund time =\

[Cyrus79 0]

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Personally, I like zoom buttons completely blocked off. I've never had a customer complain about lack of zoom in their video...

I use the zoom function when using the Optica lens, I just bump it up 3 notches for outside freefly or even tandem vids. I know Arizona Arsenal's camera flyer Sara does this as well...the access is a plus for some.

[PharmerPhil 0]

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Personally, I like zoom buttons completely blocked off....

Not me. I use a zoom many times on each tandem skydive. Maybe not in freefall, but I often use it on ground footage before the jump, zooming in on the pilot's hand on the throttle on take-off, the customer's face right after wheels up, the student's friends further back in the plane, and most importantly, on the tandem pair descending under canopy before landing. Never had a bust because of a zoomed in vid on a tandem. But I think vids I see shot with only one very wide lens setting the entire time are kinda amateur looking.

Just my too sense...

[DSE 5]

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Maybe not in freefall, but I often use it on ground footage before the jump, zooming in on the pilot's hand on the throttle on take-off, the customer's face right after wheels up, the student's friends further back in the plane, and most importantly, on the tandem pair descending under canopy before landing. Never had a bust because of a zoomed in vid on a tandem. But I think vids I see shot with only one very wide lens setting the entire time are kinda amateur looking.

this is one example where stock footage is very helpful. It's also why we can assemble vids with custom titles in less than a minute and you can't.

Cage looks great, cookie!

[parachutist 2]

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Personally, I like zoom buttons completely blocked off....

Not me. I use a zoom many times on each tandem skydive. Maybe not in freefall, but I often use it on ground footage before the jump, zooming in on the pilot's hand on the throttle on take-off, the customer's face right after wheels up, the student's friends further back in the plane, and most importantly, on the tandem pair descending under canopy before landing. Never had a bust because of a zoomed in vid on a tandem. But I think vids I see shot with only one very wide lens setting the entire time are kinda amateur looking.

Just my too sense...

Everybody's got their preferences. I like simplicity and I think it can make for an enjoyable video... the camera body just needs to be moved around more instead of the in/out zoom function. Either way can work to produce a good video. I just like the simple way of a fixed lens because it's more consistent for me.

I think I found one of yours online. Assuming it's yours, you did run into one of the pitfalls that goes along with zooming in & out: focus issues. There's a fuzzy landing shot as a result. I am confident it happens to everyone eventually if zoom & focus are not fixed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q80jlLOp5E


Chris

[PharmerPhil 0]

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this is one example where stock footage is very helpful...

DSE - You can't use "stock" footage to show the actual tandem student's face on the plane, the student's buddies, or the student's landing.

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...There's a fuzzy landing shot as a result...

parachutist - You got me on this one. That was one of my earliest tandems on the HC-5. The fuzziness was because the HC-5 is slow to focus (this never happened on my PC-1, TRV-38 or DCR-900). I use manual focus in freefall, but auto focus on landing and ground footage. Unfortunately, the HC-5, and other Sony HDV cams, are very slow to auto focus at long distances (you can hear me saying "f%&#" in the vid). Since this video I simply and quickly zoom into anything (usually the ground) after changing to auto-focus to lock focus. Once it achieves auto-focus, it stays locked on. Many examples of good zoom and auto-focus can be found on any of my favorites here.

But manual focus and zoom settings for freefall distances wouldn't work for the long-distances involved in landing shots anyway. Although if I had left it wide-out, you probably wouldn't have even been able to tell 'cause the tandem pair would have been too small to matter (or to see clearly). No thanks. I will use the right setting for the shot, not a "one-size-doesn't-fit-anything-ideally" setting.

...

[DSE 5]

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DSE - You can't use "stock" footage to show the actual tandem student's face on the plane, the student's buddies, or the student's landing.

No, you can't. But for throttle shots, take offs, altimeters, out the window, aircraft rolling up, taking off from underbelly shot, and other riggied pieces, you can. Which is a HUGE part of using set it/forget it camera settings. It's pretty rare our TI's aren't setting down right in front of the vidiot, so we get the landings up close.
But, that's another thread....;-)

[Icon134 0]

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No, you can't. But for throttle shots, take offs, altimeters, out the window, aircraft rolling up, taking off from underbelly shot, and other riggied pieces, you can.

The only problem I have with cutting this sort of thing into a Tandem students footage is that I've seen some really horrible editing using footage that is obviously from some other type of camera, footage from an entirely different plane, different weather conditions or time of day, among other things on some videos where "stock" footage is edited in between footage shot on the same day...

just to clarify DSE I'm not suggesting you personally have created tandem videos with such things just that I've seen it... so if stock footage is used it needs to be done well... and used in the right way...

Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife...

[DSE 5]

*hopefully* the stock media has been shot with quality equal to the footage being shot on the DZ, I agree. Using the same/similar camera will assure this is done.
For tight shots such as throttle, most bird-views, altimeters, no one (especially not the student) cares about the weather in the background. Tight shots are for transisitionals or cutaways and are just eye candy.

to agree with your point, I've seen one DZ that is cutting VHS quality stock into their CX100-scquired footage, and it looks horrid.

[davelepka 4]

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*hopefully* the stock media has been shot with quality equal to the footage being shot on the DZ,

Even if the stock footage is the best stuff you have, different lighting conditions on different days will show through in the end. An altimeter shot taken on a bright sunny day will look different than a shot of the student sitting in the plane late in the day with an overcast.

I prefer to shoot the entire video each time for a couple of reasons. First, it allows me to get away from the framework of the stock footage if the situation presents itself. Sometimes life drops a new or unusual set-up right in your lap, and if I'm personally shooting every shot, I can weave whatever presents itself in to what I already have in the can.

Second, and this is subject to having an editor, when I drop my tape off after the jump, I know it's good to go, with no edits needed. I shot it in such a way that the editor is really just making a dub. This comes from years of editing my own stuff off of Hi-8. where you had to shoot it right the first time, or the editing would take forever.

In terms of not using the zoom, that's just silly. You're just limiting yourself as to what you can do. I use the zoom and auto focus for everything except freefall, and never have any problems.

Before I don my helmet I make a mental note of the last shot I made in the plane (also handy for planning your next shot) and make sure that I remember myself setting the manual focus and the zoom correctly. It's only two items, and if you take care of them after your last handheld shot in the plane, it doesn't take any additional time.

Along those same lines, I flip on my still just to double check the settings as well (I have a top mounted still so I can see the back of the camera).

In truth, my camera procedures are the simplest part of my gear checks, and if you have your head in the game, it's not hard to get them done. If you sit there and cock around with your buddies, and wait until the door is coming up to don your helmet, you're going to miss stuff. (A good reason to get your lid on early is to keep it off the floor when the fun jumpers start getting up and moving around).

If you act like a professional, and make doing your job your first priority, it's easy to get stuff right.

[DSE 5]

Certainly no one would ever confuse me as a "professional." I don't know anything about eye trace or any of that important stuff.
Frankly, broll matters very little in skydiving and most broadcast video. The story matters and Nothing else. Ever.

[davelepka 4]

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Certainly no one would ever confuse me as a "professional."

Sorry man, when I switched over from talking about stock footage to talking about using zoom, I wasn't speaking directly to you anymore. I was addressing another topic in the thread.

Truthfully, I think a good percentage of what I say isn't really directed at one person, but more of general statements for anyone reading.

There's no doubt you're the pro here. I may have an edge in terms of flying techniques, but when it comes to anything else, you're the forum mod for a reason.

[mnskydiver688 0]

Are you saying DSE can't fly? It isn't very nice insulting someone who is physically challenged. Although I would agree. DSE is better suited to sit on the ground so all his "NEW" fangled techno stuff can't be used to make the rest of us look bad.

Now in all seriousness, in regards to stock footage couldn't someone take the shots on a sunny day and then auto-correct the brightness and color to fit the individual tandem videos?

Sky Canyon Wingsuiters

[PhreeZone 20]

Its far easier to think it out ahead of time and have 3-4 templates with similar stock footage. One built for sunny days, one for cloudy. Same for having a Spring/Fall and a Summer set if you are doing lots of outside panning shots. Total of 4 folders of prebuilt shots will take care of you for 95% of the situations out there.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[davelepka 4]

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Its far easier to think it out ahead of time and have 3-4 templates with similar stock footage

Isn't it just easier to shoot the whole thing on each jump? Aside from Mullins KA, there's plenty of time on each load to shoot the actual events for the customers.

Stock footage has it's place, in case there's a technical problem in the plane, or another issue that's more important than you getting your shots, but on the average day on the average load, just record the event as it transpires. That's what you're paid to do anyway.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but with a template system, you have to cut your footage into the correct pieces and install them into the template, right? I can't see how this would be faster than just having the complete video ready to roll right out of the camera. Add a fade in/out from your leader or whatever, and move on, no?

(I'm just guessing, as I said before, I'd rather just pay the editor and go make another jump)

[PhreeZone 20]

We use a single templete and shoot 90% of the skydive in camera on CX cameras. When you look at it at the end of the day out of a 10 minute video only about 6 minutes of that really is unique, the other 4 minutes is all repeated footage. By having it already on the templete we can prerender it so that it saves time when we make the DVD. That all can save a lot of time so that the customer is able to have the DVD in their hand before the next plane has even landed. With a single editor putting out 45-60 Videos every day if not more and most of the camera flyers doing double backs or every other load jumps being able to save even 2-3 minutes per video can really add up at the end of the day.

If you mail out DVD's later or don't mind having customers wait for 30-40 minutes for a video then its not an issue to worry about but if you want to hand them a DVD and a CD with in 10-15 minutes of getting them out of their harness you need to shave minutes off the render everywhere you can while not shorting the customer for the footage in any way.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[DSE 5]

There is a reason B roll exists in the first place;
Provides a cut from subject shot
Provides a means of continuing eye trace without losing the story
Allows for extreme closups, extreme wides whatever, without negatively affecting story line continuity.
Covers shooting FUBARs
Furthers the story/provides visual support of statements.

Audiences are virtually never aware of lighting, clouds, etc in b roll. Watch any show on A&E, Discovery, or similar. MUCH of that content is stock footage. Stock can also be used to demonstrate the passage of time, or display shots otherwise not achievable in the production shoot, ie; how can you shoot the underbelly during takeoff if you're in the plane?
Audiences aren't for one second aware of how an altimeter is lit unless it's badly lit.

At the end of the day, it really doesn't matter. What matters is what you're comfortable shooting for the edit. Those that shoot for the edit will generally output better, more consistent, and more watchable video than those that don't.

As far as cutting in the "correct" pieces, you already do this. Every time you start/stop the camcorder, you you generate a new file. In other words, it's already cut up when you shoot for the edit.
As mentioned earlier, its the technique that is used to cut tandem videos together in under two mins, complete with titles that contain the student's name, date, and a happy ending with their name, etc.

Everyone has their own techniques and it's not for me to say anything "bad" about them. However, if you're a tandem op and speed is critical, there is simply no way, no how, that without using template based editing can you ever approach the speed and quality of a template-based system that has had some forethought put into the process. With 5-6 templates, consistency, speed, and quality of output are guaranteed, every time. The *only* way a videographer can screw up is to shoot soft/blurry, or miss a shot completely. Even then, the video can be saved through clever editing. But...shooting and editing are my schtick. I might not fly as well as many of the camera flyers here (and probably don't), but at the end of the day, the student doesn't give a shit about flying skill. They just wanna see one thing; Their experience re-lived as a story start to finish, that stars THEM.
FWIW, we have a guy at the DZ that can outfly me upside down and backwards, with his eyes closed on Sunday. My videos are much better than his. Not only in my opinion, but in the opinions of our editors, DZO, and students that buy the videos. The guy that has it most right, IMO, is Mike McGowan. He understands what people want to see in their tandem videos.

**disclaimer, this entire post relates to tandem vids, nothing else.

[PharmerPhil 0]

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...the student doesn't give a shit about flying skill. They just wanna see one thing; Their experience re-lived as a story start to finish, that stars THEM.

Amen. That needs to be said (and heard) more often.