Its Time for Headdown

[NathanL100 0]

Allright, so I'm totally stable in a sit and stand I can lay a SWEET base or come in and take docks on a base no problem (I think my record w/ my buddy is something like 8 docks in a dive) and now I think I'm ready to start working on my headdown!!!!!!!! I've done lots of headdown exits and I'm good at those I've also done two solo dives where I've done nothing else, but try and get vertical on my head. I can hold a heading and turn no problem and I'm totally stable, but I'm hauling ass backwards. I can't seem to get vertical and stop my backward movement w/o corking. I know that my legs aren't wide enough and I can't seem to figure out what to do with my arms. I've tried holding my arms in a delta position but that seems to make me go too fast. If I hold my arms straight out at shoulder height it seems to slow me down to a good speed, but I'm told it takes a lot of air away from my legs. Also for some reason I feel more comfortable in a daffy than in an X-man position, but everyone tells me to get my X-man before the daffy. Any thoughts suggestions?

Base # 942
The race is long and in the end, its only with yourself.

[freeflir29 0]

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everyone tells me to get my X-man before the daffy

Bad advice!!! Do what YOU are comfortable with. I haven't EVER flown in an X. Lets see....body position....Make sure that your hands are LOWER than your elbows. Put your feet where they are comfortable. Now...since you know you are backsliding try to push that rear leg back more until you feel air pressure on it. Pull the front leg more straight above you. Do a couple solos where you work on nothing but feeling what the air is doing on your feet. Practice moving so you feel air on your back foot and then change to feeling it on your front. In a daffy your feet and legs are your main control surfaces. Also, make sure you don't have that front knee pulled down too far. I see that cause backsliding fairly often.

[blazingcannon 0]

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I can't seem to get vertical and stop my backward movement w/o corking. _______________________________________________________ -It's probably going to be either your head or your shoulders. When people lift their arms at their sides, they tend to engage the shoulder muscles as well so that the shoulder assembly shrugs up toward the ears. On the ground, try relaxing your shoulders, then lifting your arms like you would when you're headdown (you should be able to see your hands at the side of your peripheral vision) See if you're adding a shoulder shrug in there too. You should be able to lift your arms without adding in the shrugging which might cause an arch, which would tend to make you take off backwards. If you do this correctly, it might feel like you're slouching a bit. Check your relaxed neck position on the ground- if you tend to stick your neck out forward, tuck your chin in a bit. Might feel kinda strange but if your head is straight up-and down when you look at your side profile in a mirror, that's the ticket. Hope this helps! : ) I know that my legs aren't wide enough and I can't seem to figure out what to do with my arms. I've tried holding my arms in a delta position but that seems to make me go too fast. If I hold my arms straight out at shoulder height it seems to slow me down to a good speed, but I'm told it takes a lot of air away from my legs. Also for some reason I feel more comfortable in a daffy than in an X-man position, but everyone tells me to get my X-man before the daffy. Any thoughts suggestions?

"Spread your legs and fly"

[Trent 0]

Some of the best flyers in the world feel that you should NEVER have to fly in a full daffy. In fact, every coach I've seen teaches the X position first. If you're a big guy, you might need the daffy to slow down enough to hang with other people, but I know a couple of 200 pounders who STILL don't need to fly daffy.

Learning a daffy to start might feel easier, but it will probably give you a hard time when you're trying to learn more advanced movement... like carving, or side-sliding. If you learn to fly X well, you will be able to use a daffy when you need to, like when you're trying to stay with something REALLY slow on your head.

Learning the X position first is not bad advice, it will help your learning and progress as you get better at head-down flying.

Unless of course we're all wrong.

Oh, hello again!

[blazingcannon 0]

Ya, when I was learning too, they were saying "learn the X first"
I've found that daffy's very comfy when you're hangin out, and flying with slowies.
but I have more range of movement with the X positoin. I can use my hands to dock at the sides and front, wheras if I'm daffy with my legs totally front and back and I take my arms away to dock, I end up losing balance.
I found when I was training for my ball test, I started trying out daffy and X to see which one was more useful, and the X won out.
Daffy's definitely more comfortable, though. : ) Ahh- daffy. : )

"Spread your legs and fly"

[freeflir29 0]

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wheras if I'm daffy with my legs totally front and back and I take my arms away to dock, I end up losing balance.

Uuummm...maybe I'm just stupid but I think the GOAL is to learn to fly by using ALL positions when the need arises. It IS Freeflying right? I certainly don't feel that it's a good idea to tell a newbie that he HAS to learn one or the other first. People seem to have enough trouble just "Getting it" I don't think I want to make it any harder by restricting body positions. Getting someone to relax and be comfortable seems to be the biggest hurdle in the begining. I'll put my disclaimer on though..."I only have 262 jumps so I don't know shit!!"

[Trent 0]

It's like any other sport, man... you learn fundamentals the RIGHT way early on, so you don't develop bad form later on. It makes learning harder at first, but speeds everything up later on. It is possible to get people to relax while learning a position that is new to them. If it wasn't how'd you learn any body position. It takes time. Among all the pro's I've talked to, the consensus is to teach the X man first, then let people develop their own style. You have to have patience, it takes work to get things right. When I was learning, I put in 262 jumps alone on just sitflying so that I could get it right before moving on. It was hard, frustrating, and it took a long time, but it paid off. I think if you put similar effort into head down, you'll be better off for it.

Oh, hello again!

[blazingcannon 0]

*deep breath for longwinded response...*
re:--I certainly don't feel that it's a good idea to tell a newbie that he HAS to learn one or the other first.--
You'll notice that my post is pretty much relating my experience having been there and what has worked best for me.- I don't think there's any danger for newbies there -We ultimately have to choose what information will work for us and which won't : )
re:--Uuummm...maybe I'm just stupid but I think the GOAL is to learn to fly by using ALL positions when the need arises. It IS Freeflying right? --
I dunno, that kind of dips into Olav's unique concept of what he thinks FreeflyingTM should be, doesn't it? Does Freeflying mean the same thing to everyone? Think about how many Freeflyers you know that shun doing a flat dive.. I can think of SO many! And, does it really matter as long as you're having fun? : )
Also, it may be cool to try to fly all positions (there's nothing wrong with being adventurous...isn't this how new stuff gets invented?), but some positions are going to be more stable than others, others more comfortable, others will be more compact. ie. Try to fly a really wide daffy with legs sticking out front and back, and then hand-dock on someone right in front of you - very comfy position, but not really useful for docking cause you're leg's in the way- can't reach! : )
So it's not about restricting body positions, it's about learning the positions that will give you more choices once you can fly them. (like Trent says too )
Re:--Getting someone to relax and be comfortable seems to be the biggest hurdle in the begining.--
I think the biggest hurdle starting off headdown is getting over the disappointments and frustration of learning through trial and error - things that cause tension!
Cheers,

"Spread your legs and fly"