The111 1 #1 March 28, 2004 I'd make this a poll but multiple choice answers suck. This question is prompted by my recent cutaway, and I'm curious if with skill, linetwists on opening go down a lot or if it's something that still happens frequently and you just have to deal with it by kicking out of them before they deteriorate into a sprial. I'm looking specifically at people who have a lot of WS experience, and know they are dumping symmetrically. Do you still see linetwists at all? Or just once in a blue moon, like on freefall jumps (freefall I see linetwists 1/50 jumps at the very most)? As I said in my other thread, in my first 14 jumps I have had 10 perfect openings, 2 cases of a few linetwists, and 2 cases of a LOT of linetwists, the last one needing a chop.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 140 #2 March 28, 2004 sorry if I am not the kind of person from which you principally requested an answer, I only have 8 jumps, but no line twists. I fly a Sabre1 150 loaded approx 1.1 and have a "big" PC with a long bridle. Do you use a "standard" pilot chute ??? this might be one reason for line twists. Also maybe if you deploy at very low vertical speeds, it could cause twists due to hesitation of the bag during deployment.scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 1 #3 March 28, 2004 I wasn't aware that WS jumpers used larger PC's... I only knew of longer bridles and cut corners. How many others use large PC's?www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 140 #4 March 28, 2004 there is a poll about the mods... that really helps to pull everything out much faster and straighter, and with less hesitation at low speeds. I don't know the size I have on my standard and my big PC, but the big one is around 50% bigger than the other onescissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VectorBoy 0 #5 March 28, 2004 I rarely get line twists while wingsuiting. But while I was at Rantoul I got them almost back to back for a few days. SM1 helped me sort out some issues with wicked PC throws from just being overtired and viola, none after that except for the rare event. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,073 #6 March 28, 2004 I had several incidents of line twist on opening when I first started but they have largely gone away. I still get them on occasion when I'm tired after doing back-to-back WS jumps. 90% of the time it's because I get lazy and don't maintain perfect symmetry (i.e. my pull hand is slower than my left hand when I go back to full flight.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
katiebear21 0 #7 March 29, 2004 Quotemy pull hand is slower than my left hand when I go back to full flight Bill - you make it sound like after you toss, you expand your wings instead of collapsing them in front of your body (near your handles). Is that correct? If so, what's the reason? Katie Get your PMS glass necklace here Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 1 #8 March 29, 2004 QuoteBut while I was at Rantoul I got them almost back to back for a few days. SM1 helped me sort out some issues with wicked PC throws from just being overtired and viola, none after that except for the rare event. Care to elaborate on your "wicked PC throw" issues? Was there anything more to it besides the fact you were tired?www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,073 #9 March 29, 2004 >Bill - you make it sound like after you toss, you expand your wings > instead of collapsing them in front of your body (near your > handles). Is that correct? If so, what's the reason? If I throw and then immediately tuck in I go fairly head-down, and get an even more bizarre opening. What I usually do is throw, go back to (partial) full flight until I feel opening shock, then collapse them and bring my arms in. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VectorBoy 0 #10 March 29, 2004 What I mean by wicked PC throws is...... Rantoul was a crazy place. One of the rules was no high pulls because of the relentless air traffic. You must pull at or bellow 3k. Wingsuits usually pull higher and at rantoul the flocks were usually bigger than average requiring even higher deployment. I was new to my S-3 and with 20 jumps on just getting use to greater attention it requires at pull time than my classic. Many organizers BTW believe that events such as WFFC is no place for specialty activity, such as tandems, AFF and wingsuiting. We experienced "falling maggots" on more than a few jumps. So for the most part here I was on larger than typical groups forced to deploy lower than usual, more so considering the size of the groups we were flying in. Partying for many days on end without pause, a little exhausted, behind the power curve. One thing I knew for sure I wanted to do was really get that PC "out there" nice and brisk, this is something I'm usually more fluid and smooth about doing. Well this wicked PC tossing was causing me to thrash my body position right when I needed to be smooth and symmetrical above all else. I ended up getting line twists almost straight for two days on just about every deployment. The conditions at the event caused a knee-jerk change in my deployment priorities. After talking it over with Chuck it made sense and as paid better attention to the smoothness of deployments I was again greeted with very sweet openings. Problem solved. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #11 March 29, 2004 My canopy only very rarely gets around on me even once, but I have had one real spinner that resulted in a chop in over 400 flights Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #12 March 29, 2004 I only have 45 Wingsuit dives.. I have yet to have a linetwist. I'm jumping Classics (and one GTI), on a Safire 135 loaded to about 1.5 (Conservative in comparison to my normal gear.) I have no corner mod, and a 117 inch bridle, 28 inch pilot chute. tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 1 #13 March 29, 2004 QuoteI have no corner mod Not trying to be an ass... does this mean you don't have your corners modded, or you have the "no corner" (i.e. cut corner) mod? Just curious... www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #14 March 29, 2004 5/115 flights. 3 of them were on my Classic2 in the first 5 jumps. One REALLY nasty one was at WFFC on a Skyflyer demo from Jari that was diving and I just kicked out of it. And one on my S3 when I injured my rotator cuff in flight and was wobbleing every where after then.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot1 0 #15 March 29, 2004 2 line twists in 500+ wingsuit jumps. 280 on Skyfyer 1 and 220+ on S3. No cutaways. A few 90 degree off heading openings. Infinity container with NO MODS and packing Dbag groumet straight UP. NO modified PC or bridal. Canopy: Nitron 100 with an exit weight of 201lbs. You say you have line twists on your canopy even during normal RW jumps too? IMO I'd never suggest jumping a canopy with a wingsuit that is prone to line twists at all. OR learn to pack differently until you have NO line twists during a "normal" jump, and if you have the twists still while jumping your wingsuit it probably the way your deploying. Try slowing your forward speed by bringing in your legs and hold it for abit, then as you reach back for your pilot chute arch your chest alittle with your head high and you'll feel your forward speed decrease and your fall rate increase. Throw your PC "HARD EVERY TIME" and watch it start to get full extention and not go back into your burble. Also, pay attention to your legs, as your leg wing may catch air ,and if they are unsymetrical, may cause your body to rotate. Keep them closed through deployment. Pay attention to body position in your harness too during your openings when you are unzipping your wings. My .02.... Hope this helps you some. Be safe.www.WestCoastWingsuits.com www.PrecisionSkydiving.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rustik 0 #16 March 29, 2004 Dude, like you i have low numbers, 6 to be exact, 5 on GTi. Have had a couple of twists, i knew they were coming right from the time i threw the PC, was too aggresive (couldn't relax properly) when bringing the arms and legs in, causing body to wobble. Following some chats with some other guys here, on the last one I brought the legs in first, then the arms nice and calm, because I wasn't doing everything in one go it seemed far far more comfortable. Don't get me wrong i'm not leaving the arms out for any extended period of time, there is just a tiny tiny delay following legs coming together and arms coming in.... but keeping it smooth seems to be the absolute key. best of luck! If it's safe it ain't fun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 1 #17 March 29, 2004 Quotepacking Dbag groumet straight UP Do you mean grommet to pin or grommet to reserve tray? QuoteYou say you have line twists on your canopy even during normal RW jumps too? Not really, in 200 jumps I've had them a few times, usually only 2-3 twists and probably attributed to body position.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot1 0 #18 March 29, 2004 QuoteQuotepacking Dbag groumet straight UP Do you mean grommet to pin or grommet to reserve tray? *** Groumet to pin. Straight up as your container is laying back pad down as you pack.www.WestCoastWingsuits.com www.PrecisionSkydiving.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Tonto 1 #19 March 30, 2004 Sorry about the ambiguety.. I have no mod done to the corners of my main container. It's a standard Mirage G3. I do turn the bag 180 degrees and have the lines on the bottom of the reserve container though. t Edit: 18 degrees to read 180 degrees.It's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites GroundZero 0 #20 March 30, 2004 line twists don't matter.... jump a canopy that flies flat with twists and don't worry about. I used to get linetwists all the time... no mods, just same old gear... but my canopy is ok with twists so i don't care... More recently (about 300 jumps ago?) I got the Berger bag and not a twist since. Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites The111 1 #21 March 30, 2004 Quoteline twists don't matter.... jump a canopy that flies flat with twists and don't worry about. I do... and the other day my Spectre 170 @ 1.1 spun up so bad that it was no longer flying straight (I think there was some harness shift before the twists too). It started diving pretty hard and I chose to chop. I'm going to stay on this canopy but also try to minimize the occurrence of linetwists.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites The111 1 #22 March 30, 2004 QuoteI have no mod done to the corners of my main container. It's a standard Mirage G3. I do turn the bag 18 degrees and have the lines on the bottom of the reserve container though. Hmm, I've had several people tell me not to rotate bag a full 180 (assuming you typoed www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Tonto 1 #23 March 30, 2004 QuoteHmm, I've had several people tell me not to rotate bag a full 180. Well, I thought about it. I think if the rig has a closure loop attached near the bottom of the reserve container, it would be a bad thing to do. If the closure loop is on the bottom flap.. I can't see any issues with it. If I have some, I'll PM you if I survive. If not, I guess you'll read about it in incidents! tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites gus 1 #24 March 30, 2004 QuoteWell, I thought about it. I think if the rig has a closure loop attached near the bottom of the reserve container, it would be a bad thing to do. If the closure loop is on the bottom flap.. I can't see any issues with it. Are you worried about the closing loop (if it's on the bottom of the container) rubbing against the lines? GusOutpatientsOnline.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Tonto 1 #25 March 30, 2004 Hi Gus, My closure loop is on the bottom flap. I'm not worried about it snagging anything. If it were attached under the reserve container, I'd want to keep lines away from that area and so wouldn't feel as comfortable about turning the bag through 90 (Pin to grommet) or 180 degrees (Grommet to bottom flap.) Things seem to be working out fine like that. The rig I'm using to jump wingsuits is borrowed, so I'm reluctant to go doing mods (other than the bridle/pilot chute) on it. tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
Tonto 1 #19 March 30, 2004 Sorry about the ambiguety.. I have no mod done to the corners of my main container. It's a standard Mirage G3. I do turn the bag 180 degrees and have the lines on the bottom of the reserve container though. t Edit: 18 degrees to read 180 degrees.It's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GroundZero 0 #20 March 30, 2004 line twists don't matter.... jump a canopy that flies flat with twists and don't worry about. I used to get linetwists all the time... no mods, just same old gear... but my canopy is ok with twists so i don't care... More recently (about 300 jumps ago?) I got the Berger bag and not a twist since. Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 1 #21 March 30, 2004 Quoteline twists don't matter.... jump a canopy that flies flat with twists and don't worry about. I do... and the other day my Spectre 170 @ 1.1 spun up so bad that it was no longer flying straight (I think there was some harness shift before the twists too). It started diving pretty hard and I chose to chop. I'm going to stay on this canopy but also try to minimize the occurrence of linetwists.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 1 #22 March 30, 2004 QuoteI have no mod done to the corners of my main container. It's a standard Mirage G3. I do turn the bag 18 degrees and have the lines on the bottom of the reserve container though. Hmm, I've had several people tell me not to rotate bag a full 180 (assuming you typoed www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #23 March 30, 2004 QuoteHmm, I've had several people tell me not to rotate bag a full 180. Well, I thought about it. I think if the rig has a closure loop attached near the bottom of the reserve container, it would be a bad thing to do. If the closure loop is on the bottom flap.. I can't see any issues with it. If I have some, I'll PM you if I survive. If not, I guess you'll read about it in incidents! tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gus 1 #24 March 30, 2004 QuoteWell, I thought about it. I think if the rig has a closure loop attached near the bottom of the reserve container, it would be a bad thing to do. If the closure loop is on the bottom flap.. I can't see any issues with it. Are you worried about the closing loop (if it's on the bottom of the container) rubbing against the lines? GusOutpatientsOnline.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #25 March 30, 2004 Hi Gus, My closure loop is on the bottom flap. I'm not worried about it snagging anything. If it were attached under the reserve container, I'd want to keep lines away from that area and so wouldn't feel as comfortable about turning the bag through 90 (Pin to grommet) or 180 degrees (Grommet to bottom flap.) Things seem to be working out fine like that. The rig I'm using to jump wingsuits is borrowed, so I'm reluctant to go doing mods (other than the bridle/pilot chute) on it. tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
