blair700 0 #1 December 28, 2005 Check out the Stinger I did a search in this forum but didn't find anything on it. I was curious if anyone could tell me more about them from the 'field'? I just bought a new 661 fullface for BASE but I sure hope to have a Stinger instead very soon Later Blair Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KrisFlyZ 0 #2 December 28, 2005 No field 'experience' here but it is a very new product. I saw that on the PF website this month. I need a Full face helmet for BASE anyway so, I'll be getting one Kris. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 140 #3 December 28, 2005 mine is ordered, should arrive next month.... scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #4 December 28, 2005 It appears no different than any of the other full face helmets that have been on the market for years. In fact, it looks similar to THIS helmet and shares many of the same features according to both write ups.From what I can tell, there is nothing drastically different about this helmet that makes it safer than any of the others for BASE or skydiving. The non standard face shield shape on the bottom edge makes me wonder how easy it would be to get replacements.Does it have an incredibly low price or something?"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 140 #5 December 28, 2005 QuoteDoes it have an incredibly low price or something?200€ which is around 240$ Low price IMOscissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KrisFlyZ 0 #6 December 28, 2005 QuoteIt appears no different than any of the other full face helmets that have been on the market for years. In fact, it looks similar to THIS helmet and shares many of the same features according to both write ups.From what I can tell, there is nothing drastically different about this helmet that makes it safer than any of the others for BASE or skydiving. The non standard face shield shape on the bottom edge makes me wonder how easy it would be to get replacements.Does it have an incredibly low price or something? I just need a full face helmet. Price is reasonable...especially since I pay in GBP . Being the first point of the air foil that is the wingsuit pilot that contacts the air(when flying properly anyway), I think the symmetric shape of a full face helmet is probably more efficient that my face. How much actual difference it will make to the flight performance, I can't be bothered to test. I wonder if "Hey Baby, want to pet my Stinger" will work . Can you tell I am bored at work ? Kris. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blair700 0 #7 December 28, 2005 Yo Lou, I'm not sure AT ALL, but I'm HOPING that the Stinger offers more protection in the materials for the shell and liner....ie for head strikes in BASE. I want something with SOME protection, not just a fiberglass cover....not that a Bonehead is that. I don't know the Bonehead helmet either, but personally prefer not to buy from them. Can anyone comment on the construction of the helmet and type of materials used for protective purposes. (I'm sure UC will comment when available) As far as wingsuit flying, it'll be great as well because of the shape, should deflect alot of that headwind right to my phat belly Later Blair Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #8 December 28, 2005 QuoteI want something with SOME protection I figured as much. Well the Stinger or any other carbon fiber skydiving helmet on the market isn't going to provide any real protection. Believe it or not, the tried and true Pro-tec helmet is a solid choice for REAL protection against head trauma. Throw in the kevlar liner upgrade from Aero-Oregon and you have a REAL DEAL protective helmet. We are authorized to use the pro-tecs set up that way for HALO/fast rope/water ops where your head can end up taking some serious thumps. It isn't as sexy and definately not as aerodynamic as a full face but it does protect your melon and it's way cheaper even with the liner upgrade.Plus they can take a beating unlike any CF helmet can and not break,even in the extreme cold."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Costyn 1 #9 December 28, 2005 QuoteIt appears no different than any of the other full face helmets that have been on the market for years. In fact, it looks similar to THIS helmet and shares many of the same features according to both write ups.From what I can tell, there is nothing drastically different about this helmet that makes it safer than any of the others for BASE or skydiving. The non standard face shield shape on the bottom edge makes me wonder how easy it would be to get replacements.Does it have an incredibly low price or something? Heheh my thoughts were similar. Hey, if PF want to make a helmet, fine, but don't advertise it as having better aerodynamics. Whats different about this compared to any other full face helmet? Good looking, yeah. Color coordinated with the rest of your PF gear, yes. Specially aerodynamic, I doubt it. Cheers, Costyn.Costyn van Dongen - http://www.flylikebrick.com/ - World Wide Wingsuit News Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #10 December 28, 2005 I agree with what you say about ProTec liners providing much better energy absorbtion than most other skydiving helmets. Heck1 I have worn ProTec for my last couple thousand instructional dives. However, I prefer composite/fiberglass/Kevlar/carbon fiber, etc. for their better puncture resistance. Perhaps the ideal helmet is ProTec-sized composite shell with an Oregon Aero liner. Wait a minute, that sounds a lot like a Bonehead G3 or Gunner. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KrisFlyZ 0 #11 December 28, 2005 QuoteHey, if PF want to make a helmet, fine, but don't advertise it as having better aerodynamics. Whats different about this compared to any other full face helmet? Good looking, yeah. Color coordinated with the rest of your PF gear, yes. Specially aerodynamic, I doubt it. I think you are reading too much into it. Form the PF website QuoteThe Stinger is the perfect helmet for the serious wingsuit pilot. The helmets aerodynamic shape helps improve airflow over the pilots shoulders and back, increasing lift and reducing drag. I do think that any full face helmet is better than an open face helmet or someone's face*. As such, I don't see anything factually wrong with that description. Edited to add: * aerodynamically speaking Kris. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
outrager 6 #12 December 28, 2005 QuotePerhaps the ideal helmet is ProTec-sized composite shell with an Oregon Aero liner. Why not a full-face carbon fiber ProTec? Many of my friends in Moscow use it for BASE. They are extremely happy: http://photofile.ru/image.php?id=7482194 http://photofile.ru/image.php?id=7484458&pager=4 If i wanted less protection and more comfort/perfomance, i would probably get Stinger - it looks very cute and the price is right. bsbd! Yuri. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #13 December 28, 2005 QuoteWhy not a full-face carbon fiber ProTec? Thats actually a decent alternative if you don't mind not having a face shield. The bike version has a fiber glass shell and the snow version an ABS injected shell, both have the same liners. The snow version actually comes in a BASE friendly Color too"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KrisFlyZ 0 #14 December 28, 2005 Yuri, Two questions.. 1) What helmet do you use? is it carbon fiber protec? 2) What are your thoughts on performance(wingsuit flight) with a full face helmet vs an open face helmet? Kris. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #15 December 28, 2005 QuoteI really don't think anyone is flying wingsuits so near the upper performance edge of the wingsuit that the shape of the helmet will make a measurable difference. I can think of 5 or 6 people who might be. They're the same people who saw noticeable performance gains switching to wingsuit BASE rigs (i.e. rigs that are specifically designed for their aerodynamic performance, often in conjunction with the wingsuit design). I'm definitely not one of them, but at least one of those top end flyers has decision making capacity at Phoenix Fly.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Airowpoint 0 #16 December 29, 2005 What about this one?! http://www.icaro2000.com/Products/Helmets/4fight/LT%20Integral/LT%20Integral.htmTristan Will you answer "NO" to my next question? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #17 December 29, 2005 QuoteWhat about this one?! http://www.icaro2000.com/Products/Helmets/4fight/LT%20Integral/LT%20Integral.htm It doesn't look like the aerodynamics are designed for the direction of airflow you'd have in wingsuit flight.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Airowpoint 0 #18 December 29, 2005 On this picture it looks kinda good: http://www.icaro2000.com/Gallery/Helmets/Para%20nuvole%20L.jpg Or here: http://www.icaro2000.com/Products/Harness/MR%20Tenax/MR%20Tenax.htm And on a side note, what about adding this to your wingsuit setup http://www.icaro2000.com/Products/Mosquito/Mosquito_6_grande.jpgTristan Will you answer "NO" to my next question? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #19 December 29, 2005 Perhaps my body/head position is strange, but when I am maxing out (which is the only time I'd expect helmet aerodynamics to become important), I have my head tilted much lower, looking down and perhaps a touch back, with my chin on my chest. The photo you posted shows the pilot with his chin pushed way out, looking forward. When I am trying to max out, I don't think my body position would be compatible with that helmet. I suppose that if you max out with your head forward, then the helmet would be useful. I'm not sure how various people hold their heads when maxing out, but I assume from your posts that you do that, so I'd guess there are other people who might also find that helmet useful.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot1 0 #20 December 29, 2005 QuoteOn this picture it looks kinda good: http://www.icaro2000.com/Gallery/Helmets/Para%20nuvole%20L.jpg Or here: http://www.icaro2000.com/Products/Harness/MR%20Tenax/MR%20Tenax.htm And on a side note, what about adding this to your wingsuit setup http://www.icaro2000.com/Products/Mosquito/Mosquito_6_grande.jpg What is the price convertion to USD? Be safe Edwww.WestCoastWingsuits.com www.PrecisionSkydiving.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blair700 0 #21 December 29, 2005 QuoteYuri, Two questions.. 1) What helmet do you use? is it carbon fiber protec? Quote 2) What are your thoughts on performance(wingsuit flight) with a full face helmet vs an open face helmet? Kris. Interesting topic....? I would love to hear your thoughts too. Later Blair Edited to add: Like Tom mentioned above, its not practical for someone like me, but I'd like to hear the theory and real world for those super pilots. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
outrager 6 #22 December 29, 2005 Quote1) What helmet do you use? is it carbon fiber protec? I don't use any Quote2) What are your thoughts on performance(wingsuit flight) with a full face helmet vs an open face helmet? I believe it makes no measurable difference. A really bulky full-face would probably degrade perfomance a tiny bit. bsbd! Yuri. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #23 December 29, 2005 There has actually been some studies on this in regards to road biking. The body position is very close and the results should be somewhat the same. Bottom line is that you can expect a 2% decrease in drag from using a helmet(dependant on who's study you read). The draw back in using one of these helmets for wingsuiting/skydiving is the pointy trailing edge of the helmet which could interfer with ones rig or prevent you from turning your head.There is also a noted lack of head protection from this type of helmet as well. Newer studies have shown that a rounder, smoother surfaced helmet provides excellent aerodynamic drag reduction but it varies from helmet design to helmet design."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot1 0 #24 December 29, 2005 QuotePerhaps my body/head position is strange, but when I am maxing out (which is the only time I'd expect helmet aerodynamics to become important), I have my head tilted much lower, looking down and perhaps a touch back, with my chin on my chest. The photo you posted shows the pilot with his chin pushed way out, looking forward. When I am trying to max out, I don't think my body position would be compatible with that helmet.I suppose that if you max out with your head forward, then the helmet would be useful. I'm not sure how various people hold their heads when maxing out, but I assume from your posts that you do that, so I'd guess there are other people who might also find that helmet useful. I have to say the head position for BASE, single or multiple jumper exits from the same object, to achieve maximum body position for performance, this chin to chest position probably would work the best. But IMO, using this postion on a skydive with other wingsuit flyers in the air, it can be deadly. Not keeping the head and eyes up and looking forward where your going is a peeve of mine, as I have been T-boned twice. Be safe-r Edwww.WestCoastWingsuits.com www.PrecisionSkydiving.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #25 December 29, 2005 QuoteI have to say the head position for BASE, single or multiple jumper exits from the same object, to achieve maximum body position for performance, this chin to chest position probably would work the best. But IMO, using this postion on a skydive with other wingsuit flyers in the air, it can be deadly. Point very well taken. On the other hand, if you're not going for maxed out flight, what's the point in struggling for the last 2% of performance that the aerodynamic helmet might give you? It sounds to me like this might be another one of those places where BASE and skydiving flights are diverging.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites