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mysty429

Wingsuit Flocking ==> Balloon Suit Flocking?

By mysty429, in Wing Suit Flying

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LouDiamond    1

LouDiamond
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But I feel sorry if you are a BMCI and saying big records don't exist because they are not recognized....kinda hyppocratic no?



Glen, again, I am disappointed at your, as of late, fishing techniques. I've come to expect much more from you in this area.:P


The answer is no to your question. There is a distinct difference in what you are trying to compare. Manufacturer recognized ratings ( like tandem manufacturer ratings) have been around for a long time and honored by and within skydiving as such for several decades(see the SIM it even mentions WS instructors). The same cannot be said about WS records.


Keep stirring, I enjoy a good laugh:D
"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

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Buried    0

Buried
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have never been in my wingsuit school in Z-hills and seen the big photo of Jeff Nebelkopf with his eyes "redded out" from an out of control spin.

That is all,

Chuck



heck, I'll just remember seeing him. no need for pics.

Have at you he did live.. ... right? so not that 'deadly'. ;)

Where is my fizzy-lifting drink?

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VectorBoy    0

VectorBoy
Glen, again, I am disappointed at your, as of late, fishing techniques.
Quote



Got a hook up skipper!




The answer is no to your question. There is a distinct difference in what you are trying to compare. Manufacturer recognized ratings......


Quote



Mine was not a question. Repeat after me "a wingsuit is not a tandem rig or a tandem rating". There isn't one mind in the body of a DZO , S&TA , governing body regional director anywhere that get this confused. You and your mind, I guess, are not one of any of the above NO GOVERNING BODIES HAVE A WING SUIT RATING. < that little thing is a period!

50% of the wingsuit manufacturers don't EVEN have instructor ratings. That would be to include the brand that has multitudes more performance than the ones with instructors, not just some obscure brand with only five prototypes in the sky. Went to their website, no roster of instructors required..... and they are not alone.

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RJmoney    0

RJmoney
i recently overheard a wingsuit instructor giving an FFC in which they told the students that Jeff burst the blood vessels with a suction cup then made up the story to scare would be wingsuit pilots.

someone call mythbusters.
word to your mother,
RJ$$
BASE 1117

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VectorBoy    0

VectorBoy

someone call mythbusters.



It might just take mythbusters to prove the flat spin does not exist. And the hot red head from the show just might get my suction cup.

Seriously on you tube I can watch cheesey AFF vids, malfunctions, base jumper wall strikes and low pulls galore and a few CRW raps:) but not one single wingsuit flat spin...... maybe the flat spin phenom ascends up and therefore can't be videoed without aircraft film platforms able to climb along with the victim?

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LouDiamond    1

LouDiamond
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Mine was not a question.



No where did I mention the words governing body in my last post. I mentioned manufacturer ratings. I am quite cognizant of the difference, as I am of there being no such recognized discipline (as of yet) known as wingsuiting IN ANY GOVERNING BODY.? Normally, when people end a sentence with a question mark, it is considered a question. 98.9% of third graders around the world(even in obscure countries) know this and don't confuse the two.:)
"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

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bdrake529    0

bdrake529
I wouldn't claim "deadly", but I've personally witnessed a really scary flat-spin that caused me to think for a second that my buddy might go in.

He only had a few wingsuit jumps, but wanted to try barrel rolls (despite my disclaimer that he should wait a bit). He was jumping a classic at the time, but even then, I told him the biggest thing about the barrel roll is keeping the leg wing collapsed. Sure enough, he didn't collapse it and it caused him to spin while on his back. At first I thought he'd just spin a 180, or maybe a 360 before recovering (as I had done when first learning barrel rolls). But to my shock, he kept spinning, and spinning, and his spins began to accelerate.

At this point, I went into almost a head down dive (to his side) to keep up with him since he was falling like a rock. He looked like a turtle stuck on his back and he just kept spinning and spinning. What stood out the most to me though was that I could see him trying to pull his arms and legs in (I had taught him to use the "ball up" recovery method) but it looked like he was having a hard time due to centrifugal force. He kept struggling and eventually was able to pull up into a ball which allowed him to flip to his belly and recover flight.

Upon checking my altimeter I realized that we had just burnt up about 4k. Fortunately the spin started at about 10k, so we had plenty of alt. But if he had experienced that problem at pull time, it may have been "deadly".

Neither he or I flew video at the time, so obviously I'm making this up and it never happened... But it made me wary enough that I always warn new pilots of the potential for flat spins. And it was scary enough for my friend that he wouldn't even attempt barrel rolls for another 40-50 wingsuit flights.

I've had plenty of "flat spins" myself, when I'm trying some acrobatic move (especially with bigger winged suits), but they're always really easy to recover from and at most I get one or two unwanted revolutions before I fly my way out. So perhaps "flat spins" are only dangerous for very new pilots since it seems like once you're comfortable with the suit, it's not rocket science to recover instability.
Brian Drake

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RJmoney    0

RJmoney
Dude that sucks. But i gotta disagree with not trying barrel rolls, i think induced instability at high altitudes is the quickest route to you flying your suit and not the other way around. Just like doing whatever the call the flippies you do in aff. Not doing barrel rolls for 40 jumps just builds up an unnatural fear of them and a rigidity in the sky. If you know the feel of flips and rolls you'll have a much better knowledge of how your body is oriented if you find yourself in the situation and how to most quickly get yourself out.

edit to add: i'm not sure how many is a few for your buddy but i would say to add a meaningless arbitrary number to when to start rolls; 7 (cuz its lucky).
word to your mother,
RJ$$
BASE 1117

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mccordia    74

mccordia
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perhaps "flat spins" are only dangerous for very new pilots since it seems like once you're comfortable with the suit, it's not rocket science to recover instability.



Though (like any other subject here) everyone has his own idea's and theories as to how and why. The definition you just wrote is roughly how I feel..

Barrelrolls (intentional or unintentional during exit) with the legwing open, and then not closing the legwing, but tucking in the arms (making your body a heavy center, and the open legwing a propelor) combined with the turn created by the incorrect barrelroll, seems to be the biggest reason people encounter spins. Craig had a nice one at the Herc Boogie in 2004. Incredibly fast, yet stabilised instantly as soon as he tucked in his legs/balled up.
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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phoenixlpr    0

phoenixlpr
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Though (like any other subject here) everyone has his own idea's and theories as to how and why. The definition you just wrote is roughly how I feel..


Here is mine.

Flat spins should have some connection with the suit and the leg stand. I could not get any with my Phantom.

Narrow leg stand can contribute for flat spin.

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mccordia    74

mccordia
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Here is mine.

Flat spins should have some connection with the suit and the leg stand. I could not get any with my Phantom.

Narrow leg stand can contribute for flat spin.



Ive seen people go into spins on small suits and big suits. Leg stances 40 cms wide and a legstance so wide a female pornstar would watch in envy..

Talk to any wingsuit flyer (aka birdman:P) and 90% of the people will not have come closer to a flatspin than a silly tumble at exit..

So you're just too damn good a pilot, or maybe not flying your suit hard enough:P
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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Butters    0

Butters
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Dude that sucks. But i gotta disagree with not trying barrel rolls, i think induced instability at high altitudes is the quickest route to you flying your suit and not the other way around. Just like doing whatever the call the flippies you do in aff. Not doing barrel rolls for 40 jumps just builds up an unnatural fear of them and a rigidity in the sky. If you know the feel of flips and rolls you'll have a much better knowledge of how your body is oriented if you find yourself in the situation and how to most quickly get yourself out.

edit to add: i'm not sure how many is a few for your buddy but i would say to add a meaningless arbitrary number to when to start rolls; 7 (cuz its lucky).



I agree. I think that anyone who isn't capable or comfortable doing barrel rolls and flips in a wingsuit should do some more tracking dives.

PS: Is anyone else attempting or doing back-flips in a wingsuit? I'm so close and would appreciate advice.
"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

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