dthames

My immediate thought is that I'd class that as a malfunction and stop the skydive. 3 or 4 big wave-offs then deploy my main... I'd rather not be in freefall (particularly at deployment altitude) and not be able to see what's around me. To continue it until 1500 (and to rely on a dytter to tell you when that is) is absolute insanity. No other word for it. It's not just gadget dependency - it's worse than that. It shows a serious lack of thought and understanding. I don't want to be in the sky with a robot. Just an interesting (to me) side note about time perception. Yesterday I did and XRW practice jump and broke off at 5,000 when my audible sounded. My second alarm is at 4,000. I flew and flew and flew, waiting on the second alarm. I thought, it that thing broken? Finally I looked at my chest mount....still not at 4,000. But based on previous experience, I knew I had to be getting close. On the way home I told my wife, I was not counting time but just my perception, I call it at 18+ seconds, I know I had to have flown 18 seconds (or more) between those two alarms. I was working on min vertical speed and it ended up being 22 seconds. I think our internal clocks are better than we might think, if we just pay attention. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

Yes, it's cultural, but in part due to the evolving nature of jumping. At Cessna DZs in the 70s, especially in the pre-Otter days, half the canopies in the air were rounds, and it took 100 jumps to get to jump a square. Usually a max of 4 of us under canopy at any one time. There were no "patterns", especially for rounds, you just landed in an open spot. Even if you had a square, you spiraled wherever you wanted, and landed wherever. So, we just used our eyes, and gauging altitude under canopy was (and frankly still is) pretty easy (unless you wear an eyepatch and say "Arrrrr" a lot). Eyeballing is still an important and under-emphasized skill. But with modern emphasis on everyone flying a predictable pattern to avoid canopy collisions, and with more canopies in the air at Otter DZs, there's more emphasis taught on specific altitudes for turning onto the last legs to landing. That breeds a lot more use of altimeters under canopy than when we were pups. I know that in a way this is an "anti-gadget" thread and I am okay with that. I started jumping in this gadget and Otter culture of predictable landing patterns. The article below caused me to get an audible alt so that I could keep my eyes on the sky under canopy. I think the gadgets are good assets, but poor crutches. http://www.dropzone.com/safety/Canopy_Control/Saved_By_The_Beep_754.html Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

Not getting excited when the unexpected happens is (in my book) very important. Events like this make you wonder what the person was thinking during this period of time. I also think that some people don't trust their own judgment very well. Or maybe they just never learned what a 10 second freefall delay was :) Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

Yes, after a while your BS detector will let you separate the wheat from the chaff. John, After a few months on this forum, I had picked out about 4 or 5 people that I normally paid close attention to. You are one of them. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

Read the SIM....at least section 4. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

It is the same. Don't rely on any mechanical device. Rely on your eyes and your mental clock. I have been aware of this topic since I was a student and have kept it in mind as I have progressed in the sport. I got my A license at a C-182 DZ exiting from 9,500 AGL, belly jumped some at turbo DZs, and then moved to wingsuits. I don’t think I ever had a good internal clock for a skydive, but I do have a fair feel for the progression of time. Most of my skydives have been wingsuit jumps. I got an audible early with the instructions to “don’t depend on it”. In formation wingsuit flying we do use the audible for breakoff cues because looking away from your base can put you out of position. Our “freefall” time varies all over the place depending on the type of jump and the type of suit a person is flying. 90 seconds to 3 minutes is a typical range for me. My audible’s battery got low a couple of months ago and I noticed I was not hearing all of my alarms. I didn’t fix it right away because I wanted to observe my behavior with it not working 100%. I still seemed to have a pretty good feeling for “this is about over” and would reference my chest mount to see where we were. For the disciplines where we can easily see the ground, we must learn more than we are aware of, regarding how the ground looks at a given altitude. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

It is also possible to press one of those hard plastic handles up inside the pouch. No handle at pull time can get exciting as well. I got off easier than you did, but you're right....Check those handles. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

I always like to get there before it starts and start jumping before it gets really busy. On any new field, I walk out onto it before I make any jumps. What looks flat, often is not flat. Note any less than ideal places that you might want to avoid. It is good just to walk around and get the feel of the area before you come in for your first landing there. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

Good post and good suggestion, so I am not arguing. I have not been in that situation but I would think with only one out, if the main were down in front of you, your legs could not be pointed down, toward Earth. Or at least not for long. With two out, I could see that your feet might be more toward earth. I mean with the connection point at your shoulders, you are going to be following or hanging from something(s). Wouldn't that also be a bit of a clue? Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

Do birds ever jump out of those trees in front of you? Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

I took a large pan of brownies (yes normal) to the DZ and gave them to the staff about 10-11 AM. Someone commented, "This is better than beer because we can have it now". A busy staff might not have time to eat during the day. A good snack is often very welcome. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

There seems to be a trend to smaller more precise munitions like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_Diameter_Bomb "SDB Focused Lethality Munition (FLM) Under a contract awarded in September 2006, Boeing is developing a version of the SDB I which replaces the steel casing with a lightweight composite casing and the warhead with a focused-blast explosive such as Dense Inert Metal Explosive (DIME). This should further reduce collateral damage when using the weapon for pin-point strikes in urban areas." Better to take out the 3rd floor office than to knock the entire building down with a 2,000 pound....close enough to count. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

There are people at Spaceland, south of Houston that can help you. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

If you have access to a Flysight, set the mode to Vertical speed and listen to the feedback as you practice getting slow. It is a great learning tool. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

I was cleared for solo practice but advised to not do too many solo jumps because I might be developing bad habits that would have to be un-learned. I think I did about 3 coached jumps per each 1 solo that I did, while I was a student. There were times I just wanted to practice something simple or to be free of performance pressure. But I wanted to get my license and the coaches had to sign off on the things that I needed to learn. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

I have been working toward a stable, smooth, and controlled larger suit (X2) exit from the C-182. I think I have it dialed in enough to meet my needs. I am not sure if anyone has used this exact approach before, but I have not been around WS very long either. https://youtu.be/n0CqViSJsdM Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

I say this in response to comments on the recent fatality thread where it was suggested that the jumper had some fears about stable deployment. When I first started flying WS I had control issues and at pull time, I felt that I needed to start stable and to hurry and deploy before I got sideways or something. Sometime later I really learned the value of being able to stay in the “student” deployment position for an extended period and fall/fly like that. Also learning that my terminal speed in that position was about 70 MPH helped me to be able to settle down and not be rushed even if I had a bit of trouble. The understanding that I didn’t need to rush has also been helpful with unfamiliar suits or anytime something is not ideal. For anyone that don’t think they can fall stable all folded up, I would encourage you to learn. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

I would think you have enough to worry about (getting it all correct) without worrying about the water. If the water would worry you, it might distract you from full attention to skydiving. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

Stability comes from the pilot, which comes from skill. None is inherently more stable because they can all be perfectly stable. I did however state that the traditional student position is more forgiving, which makes it perfect for people with low skill, i.e. students. When I trained students I did teach the traditional pull method, and I still believe it's best for them, because it is forgiving (which often does have correlation to stability). My comments in the post above were not meant as an instructional for students, and they were directed at somebody who is already apparently doing differently than he was taught. That choice is his, but I agree I've seen the dipped shoulder and legwing wide open thing you mention many times on FFC's, I remember one girl who actually did a front flip on her first reach. Skydive (not base): A new/unfamiliar suit, to me, is also good reason to fall back in student type methods. It took me a while to learn the value of getting all folded up and being able to stay that way, if need be, for longer than normal. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

As a beginner skydiver I was taught that at pull time to try once, reset…try again, and after two tries if you can’t get the main deployment to go for the reserve. Flying WSs I have seen people reach for the deployment handle, go back to flying, get 'stable' again, and then go for the pull again. My personal choice is that when I go to my deployment posture, is that I then fly stable and if I can’t get the handle right away (maybe fabric in the way) I resolve it while continuing to fall stable. In light of the recent WS “no pull” fatality, I wonder if there are many WS pilots that don’t feel comfortable staying in the deployment position. For me, it was a big bonus when I learned that I could sink it in and relax if the first attempt didn’t get it out. Any thoughts? (silly question) Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

If you are really interested in the data, the Flysight is a great tool. If mine broke, I would have to get another one right away. But I am a bit of a data geek. I like to see exactly what I did and where I flew. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

There needs to be a "like" button. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

edited: (misunderstood) Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

I have good memories of the static line jumps that I did in my student training. I enjoyed the challenge of just me and the wind. Welcome to the sport. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

I have never been in armed combat. But when you go to war you go as prepared as you can, with the best equipment that you can manage, the best information about the situation, the best information about your enemy, and with a plan of action. Odds are things will not go exactly as planned. The one that comes out on top must never stop learning and adapting. If you are truly not a very adaptive person, then a hard and fast rule might serve you best. I was taught that once you start flaring to NEVER let up on the toggles. But in a situation where the best choice is to go crashing straight to the ground, letting up on the toggle worked very well. Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”