FLYJACK

Nope. If you claim the FBI got it right then you would be claiming Cooper was 5' 8" plus.. The FBI used 5' 8" as the lower bound for suspects and occasionally going lower for compelling suspects.. So, you actually disagree with the FBI... The height thing is one of the most misunderstood things in this case.. and people seem to take unwarranted and over confident positions.. Things to consider,,, Suspect height recall for witnesses is not that accurate. Nobody actually measured Cooper's height. The inside of an aircraft can distort perceptions of height. When Flo wrote 6' 1" in cockpit she had only seen Cooper seated after he had passed her the note and identified himself as a hijacker. Tina said Cooper was seated almost the entire time. We know he stood up briefly in her presence, how close?. Outside the plane, Al Lee claimed Tina was 5' 6".. Tina's passport says 5' 8".. women tend to exaggerate their height, I assume Tina is 5' 8" and Al Lee's estimate shows how inaccurate estimating can be. Flo said Rataczak told the her to remove their shoes.. no indication if any stews actually did. The initial official Cooper description lower bound was 5' 9" then amended to 5'10" to overweight Tina's testimony.. because she saw Cooper standing. The FBI was over relying on Tina, right or wrong. Bill Mitchell and Robert Gregory had Cooper at 5' 9" though Cooper was seated. Men are more accurate estimating another man's height than women are. and when people read notations of height for people (for example passport or draft card) it is almost always self reported and doesn't include shoes. That and Tina's height are probably why the FBI went as low as 5' 8"... Somebody listed at 5' 8" somewhere could be 5' 9" in shoes.. If Tina was 5' 8" she could have been 5' 8.5" in those shoes.. Also, self reporting on things like passports and draft cards usually does not include fractions.. people round up or down or concatenate. I am exactly 5' 8 3/4" bare foot.. in most shoes I am 5' 10".. I would claim my height was 5' 8" or sometimes 5' 9" on documents dropping or rounding the fraction.. So, we have variables under stating peoples recorded heights on one side and variables impacting witness estimates on the other... Cooper's initial description by the FBI was 5' 9" to 6' incorporating Mitchell and Gregory.. IMO, the sweet spot is 5'10" plus or minus and inch in shoes. An individual's recorded height could be an inch or so less if without shoes.. Point is, these are witness recall estimates with variables and individual heights are usually under reported.. without shoes. Comparing apples and oranges.

Disagree completely.. the ham operator comment was vague and not accurate or conculsive. Here in the Harrison notes is the same time reference. 04:25 - 04:30 = 8:25-8:30 "Reno looks good" matches and asking stew to communicate with man (before landing).. she is not talking to Cooper. Here at 8:30 Soderlind was asking for the stew to try to contact Cooper... She was NOT talking to Cooper.

Checking the Epstein list for DB Cooper...

Yup, the description is wrong.... Emerick doesn't make sense though.. beside the description being wrong he didn't even know one was a dummy chute, how would he know the colour of the chute or shroud colour. The exterior description could have been noted by somebody handling them before they went to Cooper,, but not the chute and shroud colour, model number and length unless they were opened. (even that is a stretch) My sense is that some information is missing perhaps due to the early chaos... Either some of that chute info came from Cossey earlier and wasn't noted in the files or somebody opened the chutes. That info was not gleaned from the packing card... Somebody had to have thoroughly inspected the chute.. What if the dummy was intentional, they could have put a bleeper in it.. that chute was the only one with no seal. Somebody opens the unsealed dummy, notes the inside description and puts a bleeper in... they wouldn't want to admit in the files to intentionally supplying a dummy chute. either that or they contacted Cossey earlier than reported.

This is why I am skeptical about the accuracy of the early description of Cooper's back chute.. it may be a conflation of descriptions indicated by the 28 ft error. 5:57 AM on the 25th, there is a duplicate at 5:10 AM, Where did this detailed description for both front chutes come from.. Cossey? or ??... Cossey claimed he was contacted when the plane landed in Reno, but there is no record in the files of contact with Cossey until the afternoon of the 25th.. Unless that description came from somebody else but who would know the chute colour and the shroud colour unless it was opened before being given to Cooper.

I already posted an image, 1 of the envelops and the two pill boxes..

This is the only mention of transmitters in the chutes,, I found that the FBI was using them around that time... but obviously no confirmation that they were used for Norjak. The file about picking up a signal was very early on in the FBI dump,, FBI Part 11 p 332/3

No, not Cooper's transmitter, a transmitter planted by the FBI in a chute.. The only reference was somebody claiming no transmitters were placed in the chutes as far as they knew.. or something like that.

Not resolved.. just left like most Cooper issues.. unknown

It was fairly early in the files,,, They claimed no "beepers" in the chutes... but who knows Those 1971 era transmitters did "Beep" for about 24 hours.. The other thing is that there were two Aluminum plants.. The Reynolds plant was not West of Vancouver... that was the ALCOA plant. Reynolds was near Troutdale. When I brought this up years ago nobody seemed interested.

Old file previously release, been discussed..

You are speculating to reach a universal conclusion that you cannot know. Sometimes that is fine, but for Gunther the stakes are too high to do that. I am open to the possibility that he was actually contacted by somebody claiming to be Cooper.

Could be, but would he risk faking a letter and notes to Himmelsbach and the FBI??

I forgot that the letters to Gunther were postmarked NY... So, the person claiming to be Cooper was in NY around Feb-April 1972. He knew the phone number of a public phone at the Pan Am building. Gunther claimed he used Dan instead of DB.. When "Cooper" suddenly dropped contact .. Ed Kuhn, Mark Penzer and Gunther all assumed it was a hoax. "Clara" claimed Cooper was not wearing loafers,,, but heavy walking shoes. That was something reported incorrectly.

Only the parts of the book that Gunther presented as his experience are claimed to be true. That is why Clara's narrative even if 100% made up does not influence the identity of the person who claimed to be Cooper. Cooper's identity does not rely on Clara's narrative being true or accurate. I assume Clara's narrative was a script.. if she was legit or not. If however, any of those parts that Gunther claims as his experience are found to be a lie then that is a problem for Gunther.. Which is why Gunther claiming his multiple contacts with the FBI in 1972 would be a risk or faking the VV ad... or naming the others involved in the first contact.. it would be an obvious lie easily exposed.. According to Gunther the FBI believed his Cooper contact was a hoaxer in 1972 well before the Clara contact.. The Gunther book is an amazing mental puzzle to unravel using logic, reason and experience with the possibility that the real Cooper might have contacted Gunther. The stated colour of the parachute is irrelevant.. the media had widely reported it as white early on. I am not 100% convinced it was white but that is another argument. It could have been white, the FBI believed it was white and the media reported it as white. A hoaxer researching the case for a convincing narrative would have used that public info... for credibility.

The Cooper letter to Gunther and the Clara letter to Himmelsbach look to be typed and written by the same person...

If you have the book would you assume the VV ad isn't real.. the star graphic is added but it is the same as it actually appeared. Why would Gunther publish a fake ad that could be easily checked,, makes no sense.. Regardless, it has been independently found and verified. I have seen a copy of the page. Of course it is a logical error. The validity test of Clara's narrative doesn't negate Cooper's identity. This is a fallacy trap everyone seems to fall into. You made this error before, you assume we have everything that occurred in the case in the FBI files we have and if it isn't in there it never happened,, this is nonsense logic. I agree that it is not verified but not being in the released FBI files isn't proof of anything. Gunther claimed as fact that he contacted the FBI and Gray in 1972, it wasn't speculation like other (JFK type) books. If the FBI pointed out an obvious lie Gunther was done and the entire book would have been dismissed.. No way he takes that risk. If Himmelsbach read a factual lie in the book he would have mentioned it in those interviews.. You are conflating the context of the term hoax here and making another error.. was your DZ account hacked? ... the FBI and Himmelsbach believed the "Cooper/Clara" were the hoaxer, not Gunther. These are two different things. Even Gunther admitted "Cooper" may have been a hoaxer. Many people seem to conflate these different issues. Did Gunther make up the entire Cooper contact.... or was he contacted by a real person, (legit or a hoaxer)? The information indicates that he was contacted by somebody claiming to be Cooper... If you accept that premise the entire Gunther thing changes.

Sounds like you haven't read the book,, the VV listing is in the book and has been independently confirmed. Gunther claimed he contacted the FBI several times in 1972. Gunther named others who were involved with the first "Cooper" contact,,, were they in on the hoax? But you make a common error. Clara's story is at least partially or perhaps completely fabricated and the "Cooper" contact could still be legit.. Discrediting part or all of Clara's narrative doesn't affect the Cooper contact. In the book, Gunther told parts that were his first hand experience, the contact with "Cooper" the contact with the FBI (first in 1972) and Himmelsbach and the contact with "Clara"... Those things he is representing as true,, the Clara narrative is Clara's story. Gunther claimed he called the FBI in 1972.. and wrote a letter to acting director L. Patrick Gray III Sept 20, 1972.. regarding that "Cooper" contact. Gunther claimed Himmelsbach and the FBI have his transcripts.. and that they, both the FBI and Himmelsbach believe it was a hoax. It isn't clear when Gunther actually started communicating with Himmelsbach. So, would Gunther lie about his early contact wth the FBI and Himmelsbach in the book. The FBI could out him instantly. That is a reputational risk beyond a potential obstruction of justice charge if he lied to the FBI. For a writer, reputation is currency. No way he lies about the FBI in the book, that is too much of a risk. My take is that Gunther was legitimately contacted by somebody claiming to be Cooper.. could have been a hoaxer just trying to get money. Gunther contacted the FBI and they thought it was a hoax because it was clearly unverifiable with nothing to go on. Clara's narrative is largely irrelevant in determining whether the "Cooper" was legit. If "Cooper" was a hoaxer then we gain nothing but if he was the real Cooper we gain some pieces to the puzzle. IMO, the rational position is not to be a rejectionist but to be open to possibility that it may have been the real Cooper and what that would mean. To reject it as outright as a hoax based on opinion is not rational. If somebody makes a fact based case that proves it was a hoax then that needs to be evaluated.

If Gunther's encounter with the person claiming to be Cooper was real (hoaxer or the real Cooper) then he was in or close to NY.. from Feb - April 1972. He requested and responded to the ad in village voice. He contacted others in NY.. He asked Mark Penzer to go to a public phone in NY and got the number correct.

I checked the reference to Miller Wohl stock and it checked out.. it was in the $40's in 1977... could have been planted for credibility though...

It is self evident,, if Gunther was contacted by a pair of hoaxers then the book tells us nothing about Cooper. But, if Gunther was contacted the real Cooper it gives us clues about his identity. Jude's (DanCooperHimself) video gives us insight on the technical side of writing but it doesn't move the needle either way.. We already know Gunther was an accomplished writer... but Jude seemed to miss the premise of Gunther's book,, He was not claiming that Clara's story was factual.. or even that he was contacted by the real Cooper.. He gave his first hand experience with the Cooper contact. (His truth) He also gave his first hand contact experience with Clara and Himmlesbach. (His truth) And he gave Clara's narrative as told to him.. (Clara's truth) IMO, Gunther went through this experience and could not determine if it was the real Cooper or not. He went to the FBI and they rejected it outright,, Cooper was a hoaxer.. Gunther was not convinced. So, Gunther decided to write a book to publish his experience and let the reader decide. Gunther was really expressing his own battle with trying to determine if it was the real Cooper.. and if it was then there are real consequences for the case.

If Clara was real then Cooper was real. You are saying Cooper's identity can't be determined from Clara's story.. because it is unverifiable. Obviously his identity would have been obfuscated. But, if we assume it was the real Cooper, we can draw conclusions from Gunther's experience even outside of Clara's narrative. Cooper's location/residence, he survived, likely lost the money, and timing etc.. For Clara's narrative we have less confidence but may find some things that correlate with a suspect.. To claim it would not help if it were the real Cooper just makes no sense..

That is my read,, Clara's role was to convince the public via Gunther and the FBI via Himmelsbach that Cooper had died and was a good person right when interest in the case had increased... He hadn't died they wanted people to give up looking for him... I wonder if Cooper might have written the letter to Himmelsbach as Clara. I don't get the impression this was written by a woman.

The Clara narrative doesn't have to be all true, just enough for credibility with Gunther.. if Clara was a real associate of Cooper that doesn't mean her story has to true. In other words, Cooper being the real one doesn't require Clara's narrative to be accurate. People falsely believe that identifying the initial contact as the real Cooper depends on the legitimacy of Clara's narrative. It doesn't, I assume Clara's story is somewhat made up even if she was legit,, I just don't know which parts or how much.

Are you saying that if it was the real Cooper it doesn't help.. because the Clara narrative is unverifiable..