rdesilets

I was just reading some older posts and came across this one... and I have a question: I have a sabre2 170 with slinks and a collapsible slider (came with the sabre2). I don't believe that I have the bumpers over my slinks (I will check but 99.9% sure I don't). The whole collapsible slider thing is new to me as my previous main had an older style non collapsible slider: When I collapse my slider (e.g pull the 2 draw strings that run down the center of the slider) I usually just leave it 'where it is' - sitting above my slinks - for the entire flight. Is this incorrect considering I don't have bumpers? It seems that the outward force of the lines keep it in place (e.g. it never rides down over the slinks) and I am hoping that I have not been doing it incorrectly and been at risk for a resulting problem.. hence the post to educate me.. I am just wondering if I am doing something that is incorrect and if I should install bumpers.. or if its incorrect to collapse the slider and leave it above the slinks all together.

Yes, that is what I like about these forums is that you always get other prespectives.

I disagree with these instructors and agree with the others who commented. It is taught on large formation skyding to STAY with the formation (not under it) until the altitude of the first wave and track to their assigned pull altitude, verify you have clear airspace (side to side, down, up, front), wave off, and pull. To just get the heck out of dodge (E.g. start tracking early) is a bad thing. At break off no one knows where the hell you are and you don't know where anyone else is. Get outside from under the formation and practice "popping up" (so you are no longer low) to the formation until the correct time to track.

Not sure how you figure that his main would be open at ~1500'? He said that he was in a track as his dytter siren went off at (1500'), then he stopped tracking, dumped, and his sabre2 snivelled a bit.. and he was in the saddle a little under 1000'. You said that his cypres "could" have cost him his life, using the hypotherical situation (and you ragged on me for throwing out a hypothetical situation ) that he had a main/reserve entanglement, down plane, etc. -- but he did not and landed both canopies without incident. I said that the cypres "could" have saved his life if he did not pull when he did -- using the hypothetical situation that he did not hear the last siren and had complete loss of altitude awareness. I think we both have valid points, using 'what if' scenerios. I would submit that the lessons are a) don't loose track of altitude b) understand the problems that an ADD can cause c) value the fact that an AAD can save your life and is worth the investment My $.02..

Glad to hear you are ok.. You learned first hand that your cypres was a good investment and it almost saved your life. For those low time jumpers who don't think a cypres is worth the investment, here is a case in point.. Sure, the double canopy out is also a potentially dangerous situation, but if you did not hear the siren of your dytter (the same way you did not hear the other tone(s)) as you were tracking (and did not have a cypres) you would be dead. I bet that before this you thought you were a pretty heads up and altitude dude

Ha Ha !!! The other side of the formation was washing around.. causing me to move.. it was not me .. really ..

Why would't you stay in school, keep your business, and still learn to be a great skydiver? Are you independanly wealthy? If not, you are not going to make much money living at a dz - -especially without any ratings (e.g. instructing). More than likely, if your whole life revolves around a DZ and skydiving, you will get burned out and then what? When I was in school years ago I was bummed that I was studying and others were jumping.. My instructor told me "Skydiving will always be here.. finish your school, get a great job, and then skydive for the rest of your life".. The best advice someone could have given me.. Years later I have a sweet job, and have plenty of $ to skydive, buy new gear, travel to boogies, etc.. Just my $.02 FWIW...

I posted that I wanted to sell my sabre 2 150 (20 jumps). A person responded and is interested in buying it. Very cool. I am in Mass, she is in Oregon. Naturally, this person wants her rigger to check it out (very understandable) to make sure the main is in the condition I say it is (new). Where do we go from here. Its a catch 22, as I am reluctant to ship it without a cashiers check for fear or never seeing the $ or my main again. She is probably reluctant to ship $ for fear of never seeing the main or her $. Please advise

As you can see from the other posts.. you are not alone.. I am also a bodybuilder, 5' 9", 195. I have about 700 jumps, with the last 150 or so formation stuff (20-way -> 100-way). Prior to the formation stuff I did primarily 4-6 way so fall rate was not a much of an issue as it is now.. Tell me if this sounds familiar: As I approach the formation I would think 'oh shit... I am going to go low'... when though I put on the brakes in plenty of time. Then I stop just in time to not go low (or sometimes I do go low and its over) and spend the rest of the dive as flat as a sheet of plywood praying that I don't bust and go low... but since I am as flat as a board, I can't fly for beans so making the easiest corrections is very difficult.. I have a poly cotton suit, booties, etc, etc.. -- Ok, now for my solution: I just got back from a big way camp in perris. On the first few 20 ways I was back in the same situation (above). I did not want to spend the whole camp dealing with this. So, on the advise of Tony Domenico and Kate Cooper I put on a HUGE sweatshirt. The next dive it was like the mysteries of the universe were solved. I was flying my slot, popping up, sinking down, side to side, and overall chillin' in my slot. I thought "Oh my.. I am on the outside of a 20-way and just chillin' here with no problems..." So, advise #1 is to do the same. On your next skydive, put on a huge sweatshirt (thick cotton, pretty big on you). Of course, make sure everything is tucked in (e.g. the bottom is under your leg straps, etc) and your handles are visible. Your world will change. Advise #2, you need to get another suite. As AggieDave said "Dress for Success".. I talked with Tony afterwards and ordered a new Tony suit. I also wrote on the order form (well, Tony at Sq1 did) to make it EXTRA big using the heaviest material they had. It's a lot easier to take the suit in a little if its too big, however, if its too small thats $350 down the tubes.. Let me know if I can help anymore..

I have a similar issue. I weight 5' 9", 200. I am a weightlifter, so I have a 'solid' build (e.g. very dense). I was recently out at the big way camp in Perris and was on the verge of going low on the 20-ways.. I knew I would be hosed for the bigger stuff. Some of the more organizers recommended I put on a big sweatshirt.. so I ran into SQ1 and bought an XXL (big and bulky for me). It was totally amazing when I got in the sky with that.. I could fly (whereas when I just had my suit on I was a big X and could not fly in that position) and it was so sweet to fly around and not worry about going low.. If I needed to pop up... a slight change in body position and I will popping up, etc.. The whole concept is popping up is foreign to us bigger dudes.. I have a heavy cotton suit with booties and all the extras (on my current suit) and it did not do a whole lot for me. I worked with Tony Domenico and ordered a new tony suit with that high drag stuff mentioned above.. it has not come in yet so I have not tested it.. Anyhow, my point... try to put on a big sweatshirt just to get the feel of what its like to fly normally... then you will learn body position, etc.. prior to your new suit coming in.. Personally I would stay away from the swoop cords, etc. Sure you can 'flare out' if you are about to fly by a formation (maybe that is their only use?) but they won't do much when you are jusy flying (or trying to fly) your slot.. -Rob

Ron, great post! I was wondering if you could elaborate on what you mean by this. I think I get it but just want to make sure

Excellent point, and 100% true! I have never cutaway, in fact, in one instance that I should've cutaway, I did not. I can only hope I learned a good lesson from that and will realize that next time I need to cutaway. But, I won't know until I get there, I can say I learned, I can believe I learned, but I won't KNOW I learned until I save myself when the time comes. Angela. What about the time when you don't pull (or pull too low)? Unfortunately, there won't be a next time to learn from your mistake and try again. I agree that its a personal decision, however, I am one of those 'pro aad' guys. I made my first 200+ jumps without an AAD. I considered myself a very altitude aware skydiver. Then one day while doing an eval dive (for my S/L JM Rating) I was lurking a student (who was doing 15 second delays with a JM) and had my first experience with getting 'wrapped up in something else'.. well the student dumped, we (JM and myself) tracked and dumped. Holy Sh*t, I looked at my altimiter and I was sitting in at about 1000'... That was my first and only experience with a really dangerous (low pull) situation. I learned from it alright. I learned that I can and did make a mistake. I learned that an AAD would have saved my life in a few more seconds of freefall. Like others, I just could not afford it (prior to that incident) because I was a poor college student.. blaa .. blaa... Well, I went out and got a credit card with a $1200 credit limit; and bought myself a new CYPRES. I spent the next year paying down the credit card as fast as I could. I hope that I never screw up and it never activates. The day that it does I will be happy that I spent the money on it -- and so will my family and friends. I am not sure what you mean by this?

2000' hop-n-pop. We were doing a demo over UMass/Amherst (back in '95) and we were pretty much at the cloud base. It was kind of weird because UMass has 28+ story buildings and getting out that low almost felt like we were level with the buildings (even though we were not even close). -Rob

Thats me on the left side (the guy who did not loose his shoe) Seemed to me like a 'normal' exit from the skyvan (at least like all the other exits during the camp), I think that Mark (the guy who lost his shoe) might have been a little high and for some reason a little too close to the side

Check out this thread: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=604653 I think its along the lines of what you are talking about.

Thanks for taking the time to post this. I recently moved to Austin (2 weeks ago) from the New England. Next wed. I am heading to a big way camp in Perris and I will be flying soutwest out of Austin. I am planning on taking my rig as carry on. Was your rig not in a gear bag? I would find it hard to believe that if the rig was in a zipped gear bag the spring loaded pilot chute, even if activated, could do much harm. I have flown from Hartford to/from Orlando and each time the experience was similar to yours in Orlando -- just a quick look and a 'have a nice flight'...

Happy Birthday Kate! See you at the big way camp in a few weeks! Yahoo!!!

Joe cracks me up. He is from my DZ (jumptown, in Mass) and last month set out.. He keeps a log of his trip here: http://www.joedeal.com -Rob

This was sent out to a mailing list I am on: If you have slinks on your canopy please discuss stowing excess brake line with you rigger. A few incidents have occurred over the last month at Pepperell that have been attributed to slinks and stowing excess brake line. And I have been informed of other incidents at other DZs. A preliminary report from California has indicated that Jan Beehner Chandler's spinning malfunction was the result of excess steering line wrapping around a tab of her soft link which was supposed to be secured behind the riser. We send our sincere and heartfelt condolences to all of Jan's family and friends. We at Pepperell are all very saddened by the loss of a wonderful person, great friend and talented skydiver. She will be missed!! Paula

I have been trying to perfect my flat track now that I am getting more and more big ways (just did Guy Wrights 81-way NE Record). When I am tracking in the position described (which is also the position most of the big way veterans teach) I feel like I am "bouncing around" ever so slightly. Is that what you mean when you talk about 'going slightly unstable'. Its weird as this position is relatively new to me (last 40 or so jumps).. Kind of like I am balancing on top of a basketball and slighly rocking left to right..

A few weeks ago I had the opportunity to take part in the New England 81-way record at Orange, MA. I was in the 8-way base with Guy Wright. We took an 8-way out the door (Otter) and Guy would "set the fall rate". Once we (the base) got warmed up (and some of use put on lead) we averaged 124 MPH. Prior to 'warming up', we were at about 114 and Guy told us all that this was too slow and we all needed to pick it up. This dive was a 1 point skydive. If you are interested in the formation Guy (and others) designed you can see 2 photos here. Yahoo! http://www.newengland100way.com P.S. Kate, I can't wait until you set the dates for your next big way camp as I will be the first on the list.

You might want to check out the thread "CYPRES Save!" over in the incidents forum...

The CYPRES is designed as a BACKUP to you pulling your own main/reserve. When all else fails it is waiting to save your life. If you don't have any confidence in it, save yourself some cash and jump without one. However, the day you are burning through 750' you might be glad you invested the money in it. If it does not fire.. well you are in the same situation that you would be in if you did not have one.. however if it works like its supposed to you will be a happy, alive camper.. Personally, I have a CYPRES and am glad I do. I don't think of it as a replacement for me keeping track of my altitude, keeping current on my emergency procedures, etc. However, in the unlikely event that I did not/could not do it myself I will have confidence that the CYPRES will do its job.

My wife 100% supports me. We have a 17 month old son as well. As stated numerous times above: its all about balance. I don't 'live' at the DZ like I did years ago nor do I want to. I have my time (jumping) while she watches our son. She has her time while I watch him... and we have family time.. Its all about the balance.. I can see, however, how someone who is married and just starts jumping could find it difficult to find balance. When I first started jumping all I wanted to do was be at the DZ every chance I could. 600 jumps later its not like I have to be there..

This post was identical what I was about to write. I am also happily married and have one son (17 mos). My wife understands that I love to skydive and she supports me 100%. However, I am not at the DZ from Friday night until Sunday night like I used to be -- even though sometimes I want to . IMHO, its about balance. We have an agreement where one day per weekend I jump and the other day is 'family' time. On special events (like the upcoming 100 way NE record) I will spend 3-4 days at the DZ. The problem with most people (especially when they start skydiving) is that they have to spend every waking hour at the DZ and every dime they have (I did the same). However, as time goes on you will find that you need other things in your life otherwise you can get burned out skydiving and it just ain't fun anymore. Just my $.02..