jumprunner

You are going to tell me about economic indicators? And just what economic indicators are you talking about, the stock market? How much richer a few rich people in this country keep getting? Perhaps you can provide us with some recognized economic indicators that illustrate your assertion that things are so bad in this country. Do you see a lot of jobs out there? Nope, you dont. That is an economic indicator. Working class poverty, lack of work, layoffs, failing corporations. But thats okay, the stock market's doing fine so everything must be great. If you wonder what I do for a living, Im a software engineer, over 10 years of job experience, BS degree from a major university, top of the line in my career field, in a career field that presents itself to be in the highest demand relative to all others. Salaries are at an all time low, and there is the widest gap between salary levels and cost of living in the history of the economy as we know it. There are fewer and fewer jobs all the time, as more and more jobs are shipped to India. Or, maybe I just dont know what Im talking about because Im stupid and worthless and noone wants to hire me (or my peers, for that matter). Thats the good ol' conservative approach, isnt it? Its not the president or his policy...its you! The economy is great, economic indicators are up, and the reason why you cant get ahead in life is because you are a loser. Ive heard this kind of rhetoric many times now. So, Id like to see your rationale here in calling me a loser, or whatever it is you so called conservatives say. Dont forget my credentials and job experience in your rebuttal.

Stock market is at its highest EVER. More people own homes than EVER, unemloyment is lower than it has been in years. Like it or not while you may wish for the economy to be bad, the indicators used by the financial world point to the economy being better than it has been in a number of years...And this is after 9/11 and the dot com bust. And, umm, what planet did you say you were on? I want to know cause Id like to go there, sounds like paradise.

Yea, attacking Iraq when Al-Qaeda resides in Northern Pakistan really makes us safer. I feel so safe now, knowing that the same terrorists that conducted numerous attacks stateside are now in a safehaven in Pakistan, laughing at US troops fighting terrorism in Iraq. I guess if I were them, Id be laughing too. Lets go over a few moments of history. Al Qaeda, residing in Afganistan, attacks the US in several terrorist incidents, then moves to Pakistan. Bush, in an effort to stop Al Qeada terrorist attacks, attacks Iraq. Does something sound a little 'backwards' here? Its like having Jed Clampitt in the Whitehouse.

You are going to tell me about economic indicators? And just what economic indicators are you talking about, the stock market? How much richer a few rich people in this country keep getting? Obviously, like so many other Republicans, you measure the state of the economy from the top down. Since you dont mind doing that, I guess you can say that Mexico has a fantasic economy, because there are a few extremely wealthy people there who just keep getting richer. Even though when you go there, you see nothing but people in the street begging for food, and migrant workers who have to cross the border for work. The state of the economy is measured from the working class. Namely me. And I have continually seen my jobs shipped overseas to India during the entire time Bush has been in office. i have seen so many of my peers, highly educated people with over 10 years of job experience, out of work, broke, cant find employment in thier career field anywhere, because their jobs where shipped overseas. Is THAT your idea of a great economy??? If it is, then you must be a corporate CEO. One of the very few Bush seems to be doing something for. If you want an economic indicator, why dont you try taking a look at the state of the working class. They DO represent the majority in this country, you know.

One big difference is there are numerous Islamic societies that embrace these "barbaric" practices, whereas, I don't think there are any Christian ones. Oh, is that right? No Christian ones????? "I am sick of this life. I dont want to live another 10 days in this life" -Reverend Jim Jones, Jonestown, prior to the slaying of over 900 members of his congregation, mostly with forced injestion of sodium cyanide. Was Reverend Jim Jones a Muslim? No, he wasnt. He was a Christian. Do you consider the blatant murder of over 900 people, 300 or which were children, to be barbaric? Youre right, Christians dont embrace 'those' barbaric methods, they have a completely different set of ones. One of which currently entails fighting an illegal war of aggression in Iraq and the deaths of over 3000 US military, not to mention countless other civilian deaths.

Unfortunate, isnt it? Ditto.

My answer is: Ofourse Not! After sending our jobs overseas, decimating the economy, making the few richer while everyone else keeps getting poorer, starting and maintaining an illegal war of aggression against the will of the public, creating a huge defecit that we all will be left to pay for, degrading our reputation as Americans to the international community, and the list goes on and on. The Bush/ Cheney gang is blatant about one thing, that they dont have any respect at all for Americans or America for that matter. I would have more respect for them if they were behind bars where they belong.

Ummm, are you, by any chance, "The Professional"? Gee, we may just have a job for you.

Well, I am extremely ashamed of having someone like that in the White House representing this country. And, ofcourse, it doesnt stop there. Like in Abu Gharib, where kidnapped prisoners were forced to have homosexual sex acts with each other at gun point. This is how Americans are being represented to the rest of the world, as a bunch of sick, murdering perverts, with Bush leading the way. Jim Webb has helped me recover my view of what this country is. Im glad there is a politician out there that is a real, and honorable American, who also has served honorably in the military, unlike Bush, who couldnt even fulfill his obligations in the National Guard. Im appalled that there are people out there who will actually support someone like Bush and his band of maniacs. People like that have no regard for this country at all and lack any form of moral character whatsoever. But do they care? Ofcourse not. And that makes them who they are. Its a free country, which means they can trash it all they want. And they do.

have you read the entire report? Saddam did NOT tell the truth. Here are some quotes from the UN timeline from the Link you supplied, (which I have read). "9 Sep 1998 Security Council resolution 1194 (1998) unanimously condemns Iraq’s decision to suspend cooperation with UNSCOM, terming Iraq’s actions a totally unacceptable contravention of Iraq’s obligations; demands Iraq rescind its decision and decides not to conduct the 60-day sanctions reviews until Iraq does so and the Commission reports to the Council that it is satisfied that it has been able to exercise its full range of activities, including inspections." "12 Nov 1997 Security Council resolution 1137 (1997), condemns the continued violation by Iraq of its obligations, including its unacceptable decision to seek to impose conditions on cooperation with UNSCOM. It also imposes a travel restriction on Iraqi officials who are responsible for or participated in the instances of non-compliance." "Sep/Oct 1997 UNSCOM inspection teams are prevented from inspecting three sites designated for inspection, on the basis that the sites are "presidential sites", which Iraq claims are out of bounds to UNSCOM's inspectors." "Oct 1997 UNSCOM completes the destruction of additional, large quantities of chemical weapons related equipment and precursors chemicals. Iraq had previously denied that part of the equipment had been used for CW production. Only in May 1997, on the basis of UNSCOM's investigations, did Iraq admit that some of the equipment had indeed been used in the production of VX." When is it going to be permissible for Iran or the UN to inspect the US for WMDs? Oh yea, we already admitted to having them, but thats okay, we are not a threat to anyone. All we do is overthrow foreign governments that Bush doesnt like and kill a lot of foreign nationals. We're the good guys!

Where was the Iraq war during the eight year Clinton administration? It started up with Bush's dad in office, completely died out during the Clinton years, then started back up again after Bush was elected. Anything smell just a 'bit' fishy here?

I have to agree 100%. I was hoping to hear more on healthcare, mostly on medicare/medicaid and funding to help us with HIV but what I heard was just back patting and nothing substantial. I glad that people in Africa are getting the meds that they need but, what about Americans? My meds were cut off 5 years ago. My medicaid was cut off last year and my medicare ended on Jan. 1st (I went ahead and stopped it several months ago to save myself the money that I paid to have it. Seeing that it was going to end, there was no reason to wait untill Jan 1st.. Being that I only got 2 visits to the doc a year it was a major waste of money that I could use for food and bills). I am not to happy to see that people in Africa are more important to our government than its own people. How about sending me some free meds? Another lame speech by a lame duck. They should send you some free meds, after all, you paid for them! Now, they see fit to deny you of the medical help that you PAID for out of your own pocket, and they are using your money to give someone else the medical benefits that youve earned. And why? Because under this administration, you dont matter, you are not importand, you dont count for anything. Im sorry to see you having to go through that kind of garbage, but this is a perfect example of what I am talking about. This administration is not on our side, and never has been.

Did anyone appreciate Jim Webb's speech rebuttal of the address? He may be contacted at the following address: http://www.webbforsenate.com/contact/index.php I have already contacted him thanking him for his support of the flailing working class under an administration that cares nothing at all about the average American. During his speech, Bush made his point, Namely, that he doesnt mind using OUR tax dollars to the benefit of those overseas, while at the same time, robbing us of our jobs and plundering the economy. The average American under this administration is just plain screwed, has absolutely no importance in the world whatsoever, doesnt count for anything at all, other than someone who can be lied to, robbed and abused for the benefit of foreign interests. I have had enough. More than enough, for a long, long time now. If youve had enough, then contact Jim Webb (D) Virginia, and show support for the points he made during his speech. Things under this bizarre administration are deteriorating fast. We all need to do anything we can, everything we can, to put a stop to this insanity before things go any furthur. There has been an ungodly amount of damage done to the reputation of this country, to the welfare of this country, and to the economy of this country, by the Bush administration. It just has to stop, and it has to stop now. Write Congressmen, voice your opinion, do whatever you can however you can, with whatever time you have. We just cant afford to keep sleeping it off and hoping for some miracle to happen. The enemy is in the White House, it is called the Bush administration, and it will destroy us all if we dont start doing something about it.

Did anyone appreciate Jim Webb's speech rebuttal of the address? He may be contacted at the following address: http://www.webbforsenate.com/contact/index.php I have already contacted him thanking him for his support of the flailing working class under an administration that cares nothing at all about the average American. During his speech, Bush made his point, Namely, that he doesnt mind using OUR tax dollars to the benefit of those overseas, while at the same time, robbing us of our jobs and plundering the economy. The average American under this administration is just plain screwed, has absolutely no importance in the world whatsoever, doesnt count for anything at all, other than someone who can be robbed and abused for the benefit of foreign interests. I have had enough. More than enough, for a long, long time now. If youve had enough, then contact Jim Webb (D) Virginia, and show support for the points he made during his speech. Things under this bizarre administration are deteriorating fast. We all need to do anything we can, everything we can, to put a stop to this insanity before things go any furthur. There has been an ungodly amount of damage done to the reputation of this country, to the welfare of this country, and to the economy of this country, by the Bush administration. It just has to stop, and it has to stop now. Write Congressmen, voice your opinion, do whatever you can however you can, with whatever time you have. We just cant afford to keep sleeping it off and hoping for some miracle to happen. The enemy is in the White House, it is called the Bush administration, and it will destroy us all if we dont start doing something about it.

Are there some parallels, yes. But how many of the major parallels exist? Economic depression (no), extreme nationalism (no), totalitarianism (partially progressing towards fully but possible to reverse by not voting for politicians, both democrat and republican, who have allowed this to progress). Economic recession: Yes, huge deficit, jobs shipped overseas to countries like India, ect. Extreme nationalism: Yes, from Bush supporters. Totalitarianism: Not yet. Adolf Hitler and Sadam Hussein had their own armed troops that were members of their political party. They were able to intimidate the parliment to give up their parlimentary powers under intimidation by party troops. That is the final step to dictatorship. Bush is still subject to law and can be forcefully removed if needed. Also, right now he is growing politically weaker and desperate, trying to futilely gain the cooperation of a Democrat controlled Congress while he doesnt even have the full cooperation of the GOP anymore. Majority opinion is clearly against him and he knows it. He is at an unrecoverable loss. It wouldnt suprise me if, under mouting pressure, we see a resignation from office take place. Things are not good for Mr Bushie.

Suspended, think of it like a global half-time. This is going to be rough, I've had a hard enough time getting good at Spanish, now Chinese too? Strangely enough I've been talking about the Chinese and the dangers of China for atleast 8 years, others have been warning about China much longer then that. "We" opened a Wal-Mart there, so maybe Wal-Mart and Google will be able to take them over and end the threat, but then there's the Wal-oogle war that will probably go nuclear... Well, Ive been taking traditional Kung Fu so Im half way there. Already know how to count to ten in Chinese.

Ever heard the expression "its not whether or not you win, its how you play the game" In this case, the most importand thing is not to show any support at all for anything Bush does, and to disagree with everything he does. He can have a lot of things, but he cant have anyones mind, or cooperation for that matter. You cant do anything about what you dont have any control over, but you can do your best, and that is what counts. Voice your opinion, write Congressmen slamming everything Bush does, dont support any troops in Iraq or anything about Iraq for that matter. I believe that asshole will get whats comming to him sooner or later, in one form or another.

They left one out: IV. BEING STUPID, GREEDY, AND CROOKED 1. Lying about involvment with Iraq in order to secure oil contracts for own personal gain 2. Decimating the economy in the effort to support the rich at the expense of the working class 3. Embarassing this country with idiotic policies, lies, propaganda, and rhetoric 4. Having an extremely low IQ, somewhere in the negative range, and having a face that is so stupid looking and ugly it almost broke my TV screen several times now Funny!

I guess they have a right to do whatever they want with their lives, if they want to think like that, its their problem. It doesnt change my mind about Iraq or Bush for that matter, but it does indicate there may be more stupid people in this country than I ever imagined. That is really unfortunate, just when I thought things were going to start making sense again. Oh well Well, ummm, they are a little late for that, arent they? That happened when Bush entered office claiming to be the president, and it all continued downhill when the Iraq BS started up again.

We ignore it because it's IRRELEVANT! This thread is about BUSH -- not Clinton. You're obsessed, man. Concentrate. Try to get Clinton out of your mind. It was a decade ago! Here's an exercise: Next time there's a thread about Bush, try -- TRY -- to discuss Bush. Try to let there be one conversation about Bush that you DON'T turn to Clinton. I know it's hard. But you can do it. We all believe in you. LOL. I cant catch my breath! All Bush supporters: Try the above excersise three times a day. OK, lets settle that argument. If Clinton lied about getting a BJ and got away with it, then it is only fair that Bush should be able to lie about Iraq and get away with it. Fair is fair. From now on, if any Democrat gets a blowjob, then the suceeding Republican has permission to spend the taxpayers money getting people killed.

Somebody else who needed a job. I dont see how you benfit from anything I did, but if you insist on benefiting on something, then benefit on this: You know those gas masks and charcoal filter suits you have for chemical warefare that are supposed to keep you alive? Well, they dont, because thats not what theyre meant for. They are meant to keep you alive "a little longer", so you can fire more bullets. But in any chemical attack, your chances of survival are pretty bad. In a chemical attack, always save one bullet so you can shoot yourself after the onset of symptoms. There, NOW you benefited from my service, you now know what to do if you are exposed to chemical or biological weapons. I was in the Chemical Corps for three years and worked in a chemcial warefare compound. Heres a little more. Atropine and 2-PAM Chloride will make you sicker than nerve gas. By the time you inhale a lethal dose of nerve gas, it is too late. It is oderless and undetectable, so by the time you find out there is nerve gas in the area, you have already taken in a lethal dose. Signing up for Iraq was pretty stupid. Do you realize what Sadam Hussein could have done? How many US soldiers he could have killed? Would have made Vietnam look like a walk in the park. Ofcourse I havent said anything about biological weapons, like the Soviet manufactured yellow rain. You dont want to hear about that. There are also lethal strains of anthrax reported comming out of the middle east, and reports of people getting sick comming back from Iraq. Biological weapons are also undetectable. You know, people tend to become less boastful about military service when they are faced with things like that. It goes from "Hey, Im a hero and I fought for your rights" to "Get me the fuck outta here!". Vietnam was a perfect example of that. Wrong. The anger is projected at Bush and the trouble he has caused since he has been in office, along with everything that is associated with Bush and his type of mentality. The list goes on and on. Those who want to support him are not in touch with reality, and that is what really bugs me. They completely ignore the truth and push senseless rhetoric as an excuse for the things that Bush does economically and politically. And if that isnt enough, most who support him are the ones he screws the most. Like, for instance, anyone who isnt rich or isnt the CEO of a corporation. These are the things Im firing at, not you or anyone personally. The politics, the bullshit, the propaganda, there is no end to it. I know what youre referring to. The public medical insurance proposal. Everyone is so quick to shout "SOCIALISM!". Its always the ones who are okay and have medical insurance who dont need it that think its a bad idea. The ones who dont have it who do need it think otherwise. One calls it socialism, the other calls it a right to life. This sure is a self centered society we live in, isnt it? The question remains, will it work? It will be at a cost of 12 billion dollars, but on the other side of the coin, medical costs have skyrocketed in order to make up for those that are not insured. So if it solved that problem, then maybe it will be cost efficient, but I think it would need to solve that problem to be realistic. I dont think it is socialism, I think it is an attempt to solve a problem other than the usual "looking the other way", a political strategy popularized by the Mexican government and supported by the Republicans. As far as national medical insurance, I can tell you, that if you took all the money that was squandered away in Iraq, that had abolutely no benefit at all to anyone in the US, you would be able to fund a national insurance program with money left over. That amount of taxpayers money could have actually been used to do something good, instead of something destructive. Did anything good, at all, come out of Iraq? Did we benefit from it in any way possible? It did not stop terrorism at all, as a matter of fact, it escalated terrorism. On an economic level, they keep sending more and more troops to Iraq, the economy just keeps getting worse and worse, and the deficit keeps getting bigger and bigger. And that is what our tax dollars are being used for....to make life harder for all of us. Who do you think is going to bear the burden of what Bush is spending on Iraq? Not Bush. Take a look in the mirror....thats who.

No, you didnt benefit from it, I benefited from it. I got a job during a recession while everyone else was out of work, I got a place to live, what I considered good food every day, and a paycheck. Then, I got VA benefits which paid for college. If I had been smart enough, I would have gone air traffic controller, gotten free training, and came out with a backup career field that is recession proof. The benefits of the Army go to the ones who join it. Military training pumps more skilled workers into the economy and give those who are otherwise financially disadvantaged a chance to succeed. With all the propaganda on TV about how women with three kids are "fighting for my rights" (so I should feel like a big pussy and feel ashamed of myself because women are having to fight for my rights), it sure sounds like it. Its not just what you said, its all over the media. And I really am getting tired of hearing about it. And now youre California bashing? Im originally from the south myself, moved here from AZ several years ago. And I can tell you, Californians are the greatest people I have ever been around. From what I have seen, the majority of them dont accept mediocre in their life, they always strive to be better and do better. I dont see any rights here being compromised, as a matter of fact its just the opposite. You show me any other place where environmental groups will stand up against self interests to protect public resources as much as they do here. What rights are being compromised, Id like to know? California does more to protect the rights of the public than any other place Ive ever lived in. As far as the state flag inscription, "California Repulic", being from the south I tend to have to agree wholeheatedly with that. The rest of this country doesnt deserve to have this great of a state in its union.

You miss their point. They don't mean that it's WORSE. In fact, they know it's not related at all. They simply want you to be distracted by talk about Clinton -- ANYTHING about Clinton -- instead of Bush. Why? Because talk about Bush embarasses them. They're reawwy reawwy upset -- poor things. Oh, very well put, VERY well put. Ive noticed that, every time you say something about Bush, you hear all about Clinton. So why is it that, when you say something about Clinton, you never hear about Bush? Hardly seems fair.

Maybe if this impeachment goes through, Bush and Cheney will have a few things to cry about.

Excuse me, but I was in the Army too, okay? I almost went to the Korean DMZ in MI during active duty and after that Panama while in the active reserves. I dont go around boasting about how I was defending anyone's freedoms, or anything else for that matter. I joined the Army, was a part of what was going on at the time, and thats the end of it. I got my paycheck, benefits, and Im content with that. The military is not to blame for involvement with Iraq, right they have to take orders, however boasting about it is another story altogether. Saying things like "you are fighting for my rights in Iraq" is ridiculous, what does Iraq have to do with anyone's rights here? And Ill say it again, I dont need anyone but myself fighting for my rights. What point are you trying to make here, that I am too much of a pussy to fight for myself? So I need someone in the military to do it for me? I am capable of fighting my own battles. I do not need, or want, anyone in the military to do that for me. Did I need someone in the military to start this thread? No problem, be more than happy to. But it wont be in Iraq, it will be in the place where my rights are being denied....right here.