funjumper101

That is why Lush Rimjob, Scum Hannity, Nutjob Beck, Faux News, etc, continue to spread their lies, falsehoods, and total bullshit, without penalty They are protected by the First Amendment. If only their advertisers would muster up some ethics and quit sponsoring their crap, they would go away like Dr. Laura is going away. Not because of First Amendment Rights violation, but because their advertisers quit supporting them..

Of course not, that is a logical fallacy, but besides the fact that it is not logical, others have not claimed that all muslims are terrorists. They have claimed that the leadership of the proposed mosque has ties to Islamofacism. Big difference. You would be wrong. It is easy to refute because it is a crappy analogy. The YMCA isn't associated with anything bad that happened at ground zero. You call it a logical fallacy. That is laughable. What IS happening on this issue is that folks from all over the USA have been whipped into a frenzy of hatred over a local zoning issue regarding contruction of a Moslem Community Center in Lower Manhattan. It is a FACT that the Christian equivalent to this facility is a YMCA. If New Yorkers got involved in a local zoning issue in OK City over the siting of a YMCA, that would be wrong. As wrong as you and your kind sticking your nose into this issue. The YMCA is associated with Christianity. Christianity has plenty of history regarding child molestation, terrorism, and extremism associated with parts of Christianity. You call it a crappy anaolgy because it exposes your position as having a foundation based on.... nothing. This Moslem Community Center is not associated with anything that occured on 9/11. You may wish otherwise. You may even believe otherwise. You would be wrong. 100% totally wrong. Much like the 18% polled that think Obama is a Moslem. Thinking something is true does not make it so, especialy when the facts are completely exposed for all to see.

So then it isn't a place for many different faiths to worship, as you claim. It's just blue prints. If the RWC Sheeple that are whipped up into a frenzy over a local zoning issue have their way, the facility may not get built. The RWCs appear to be completely unaware that this particular issue is being closely watched by the entire world. Will the jingoistic Constitution haters prevail and prevent one of the world's great religions from building a community center in our most international of cities? We don't have much or a moral leg to stand on since ShrubCo had their way. Conciously shredding our basic values is not good for this country in any way. The First Amendment used to matter. Knowingly trying to stop free exercise of these rights used to be something that would not be tolerated.

Romans 13 Be Subject to Government 1Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. I'm surprised you have never seen this before. People who join the military are subject to the governing authority. If the government declares an enemy and orders me to kill him, I am obligated to obey. You would have made an AWESOME WWII German Soldier - "I was just following orders...." You are obligated to follow lawful orders. You are not obligated to follow unlawful orders. In theory, you are supposed to be intelligent enough and educated enough to tell the difference.

You failed to make a point, other than that I am extremely angry with the RWCs who are doing everything they can to divide this country and bring it to ruin, with the cheerful assistance of people like you. Answer the questions - Why is ~25,000 feet a better distance than ~1000 for the placement of a Muslim Community Center? Would it be OK for for New Yorkers to get involved in a local zoning decision regarding placement of a YMCA near the site of the Oklahoma City bombing? Timothy McVeigh self identified as Christian, so that means all "Christians" are terrorists, right? I'll bet you can't anwser the questions without being forced to question your position, so you won't.

It is also a place of worship for Catholics, Protestant, Episcopal, Hindu, Church of Latter-day Saints Bible study, and a Jewish service and Torah study during their services. It certainly is not a mosque as you tried to imply by your title. It is the Pentagon Chapel. Nice try at deception though. (as far as the Mosque being built in NY, I have no concerns about it and am very indifferent to the project) It is not a church, synagogue, mosque, etc. It is a Pentagon Chapel (the name is outside the door) used for many purposes. Quote The name outside the door is immaterial. You may want to parse it differently but the fact remains that the facility is a mosque when used by Mulims for their religious rituals. None of the definitions make any distinctions between part time and full time use. http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mosque Main Entry: mosque Pronunciation: \ˈmäsk\ Function: noun Etymology: earlier mosquee, from Middle French, from Old Italian moschea, from Old Spanish mezquita, from Arabic masjid temple, from sajada to prostrate oneself, worship Date: 1717 : a building used for public worship by Muslims http://www.thefreedictionary.com/mosque mosque [mɒsk] n (Non-Christian Religions / Islam) a Muslim place of worship, usually having one or more minarets and often decorated with elaborate tracery and texts from the Koran Also called masjid musjid [earlier mosquee, from Old French via Italian moschea, ultimately from Arabic masjid temple, place of prostration] http://www.yourdictionary.com/mosque mosque (mäsk) noun a Muslim temple or place of worship Origin: Early ModE muskey < MFr mosquez < It moschea, ult. < Ar masjid, place of adoration, temple < sajada, to prostrate oneself, pray Webster's New World College Dictionary Copyright © 2010 by Wiley Publishing, Inc., Cleveland, Ohio. Used by arrangement with John Wiley & Sons, Inc. mosque (mŏsk) noun A Muslim house of worship. Origin: French mosquée, from Old French mousquaie, from Old Italian moschea, from moscheta, from Old Spanish mezquita, from Arabic masjid; see masjid .

I'm saying that trust is earned and they are not doing anything to earn that trust. The only way that the fundamentalists are going to be stamped out is from the inside of the Muslim religion and I see NOTHING that shows me that is happening. They are pushing so hard for their right to build and DO NOT CARE that it is insensitive and strikes a very real nerve with a very large portion of both the right and left. They want tolerance, but they have no understanding or concern for the way people feel about it. They can build a Mosque anywhere else and nobody would be raising a stink about it. That is evident by the 100's of Mosques already in NYC that nobody messes with. What are you doing to "stamp out" the Westboro Baptist Church? Nothing? Why not? You say it is the responsibility of the mainstream part of a religion to "stamp out" the fringe elements, yet you and your kind do nothing about the WBC? RWC hypocracy stinks up SC again.

It is also a place of worship for Catholics, Protestant, Episcopal, Hindu, Church of Latter-day Saints Bible study, and a Jewish service and Torah study during their services. It certainly is not a mosque as you tried to imply by your title. It is the Pentagon Chapel. Nice try at deception though. (as far as the Mosque being built in NY, I have no concerns about it and am very indifferent to the project)Quote The facility is a mosque when used by Muslims for their religious rituals. No amount of parsing can rework this uncomfortable FACT. If the RWCs want to be morally and ethically consistent, they must all rise up together and work to ban Musilm rituals at the site of the Pentagon Ground Zero. We are at war against Terrorism, not the Moslem Religion, aren't we? We have freedom of religion and equal respect for all religions here in the USA, don't we? Equal respect for for all religions is enshrined in the Constitution and is one of our core values, if you are a US patriot, right?

I have no problem with the New York mosque moving five miles away from ground zero. Thank you for your love, understanding and tolerance. Here is a fine example of emotion and ignorance overcoming rational thought. The 5 miles in the story refers to the distance between the site of the Shinto shrine and the Pearl Harbor memorial. Anyone with basic knowlege of the Pearl Harbor attack knows that the site of the memorial is not the only place that bombs landed and people were killed. The entire area was bombed and shot up. Logically speaking, Pearl Harbor's "Ground Zero" is the entire area, not just the site of the memorial. That puts the Shinto shrine in the middle of ground zero for the attack. The religious facility at the Pentagon is a mosque when it is used by Muslims performing their religious rituals. In the right wing jingoistic way of thinking, that means that ShrubCo placed a mosque at ground zero for Pentagon attack. There was no RWC backlash at that time. Why is that? Why is ~25,000 feet a better distance than ~1000 for the placement of a Muslim Community Center? Would it be OK for for New Yorkers to get involved in a local zoning decision regarding placement of a YMCA near the site of the Oklahoma City bombing? Timothy McVeigh self identified as Christian, so that means all "Christians" are terrorists, right? Blaming an entire religion for the actions of the fringe fanatics is wrong. The WBC is a Christian church. Does that make all Christains lunatics? The ideals of this country are being seriously challenged by RWCs. They are trying to set aside parts of the US Constitution for short term political gain. They are finding a willing and easily led audience that has no historical knowlege or perspective. The lack of basic civics knowlege these days is incredible. It is a scary time for the USA.

Anyone in the military, who was told to attend a "Commanding General's Spiritual Fitness Concerts", headliner the Christian rock group BarlowGirl, and punished for not doing so, was totally screwed by the US Government. This is total bullshit. No US Military leader should be permitted to abuse their position to force their particular version of religion on their subordinates. That is completely against the First Amendment. The general should be forced into retirement ASAP, as an example to the others who may try to pull that evil on their subordinates. The entire story reads >>> RICHMOND, Va. – The Army said Friday it was investigating a claim that dozens of soldiers who refused to attend a Christian band's concert at a Virginia military base were banished to their barracks and told to clean them up. Fort Eustis spokesman Rick Haverinen told The Associated Press he couldn't comment on the specifics of the investigation. At the Pentagon, Army spokesman Col. Thomas Collins said the military shouldn't impose religious views on soldiers. "If something like that were to have happened, it would be contrary to Army policy," Collins said. Pvt. Anthony Smith said he and other soldiers felt pressured to attend the May concert while stationed at the Newport News base, home of the Army's Transportation Corps. "My whole issue was I don't need to be preached at," Smith said in a phone interview from Phoenix, where he is stationed with the National Guard. "That's not what I signed up for." Smith, 21, was stationed in Virginia for nearly seven months for helicopter electrician training when the Christian rock group BarlowGirl played as part of the "Commanding General's Spiritual Fitness Concerts." Smith said a staff sergeant told 200 men in their barracks they could either attend or remain in their barracks. Eighty to 100 decided not to attend, he said. "Instead of being released to our personal time, we were locked down," Smith said. "It seemed very much like a punishment." The Military Religious Freedom Foundation first reported on the Christian concert. The foundation said it was approached by soldiers who were punished for not attending or offended by the religious theme of the event. The group's president, Mikey Weinstein, claims Christian-themed events are "ubiquitous" throughout the military, and he credited the soldiers for stepping forward. "Whenever we see this egregious, unconstitutional religious tyranny our job is to fight it," he said. Smith said he and the other soldiers were told not to use their cell phones or personal computers and ordered to clean up the barracks. About 20 of the men, including several Muslims, refused to attend the concert based on their religious beliefs, he said. Smith said he went up the chain of command and traced the concert edict to a captain, who said he simply wanted to "show support for those kind of events that bring soldiers together." While not accepting blame, the officer apologized to the soldiers who refused to attend the concert and said it was not his intent to proselytize, he said. "But once you get in there, you realize it's evangelization," Smith said.

http://www.cephas-library.com/nwo_bush_goes_to_shinto_worship.html American Christians were both grieved and shocked when President Bush, professing Christian, went to a Mosque and joined in prayer with the Muslims to the “Universal God.” President Bush evidently assumes that all religions worship the same “Universal God” under different names. Thus any name of any deity will do. This is, of course, not acceptable to Bible-believing Christians because Allah and all other pagan deities are demon-gods according to I Cor. 10. President Bush and his wife have now managed to alienate the Japanese and Korean Christian communities by going to a Shinto shrine and worshipping the demon spirit in the shrine. They both bowed to the demon and clapped their hands to awaken him. Then they signed the book of those who have worshipped the demon spirit who inhabits the Shrine - you can see the article from the Japan Times right here. Japanese Christian leaders (see email at bottom of the page) confirm that the Bushes engaged in pagan worship and not just a show of respect. The Japanese news services used the religious term sanpei to describe the worship performed by the Bushes at the temple. During WW II, Japanese and Korean Christians who refused to worship the demon-spirit at Shinto shrines were put to death. Now, their descendents see the Bushes making a mockery of those who, like Daniel and his three friends, refused to bow before a heathen idol. According to the Japan Times, the Prime minister of Japan remained in the car because he could not join the Bushes in worshipping at the shrine. This was due to a wall of separation between temple and state set forth in the Japanese Constitution. It forbids the heads of state from participating in Shinto worship because that was the religion that motivated the carnage of WW II and the attack on Pearl Harbor. American WWII veterans are particularly outraged at the Bushes worshipping the spirit of past Japanese Emperors as this was the motivating force behind the Japanese attack on America.

From - http://www.religion-online.org/showarticle.asp?title=1437 An American flag waves briskly in the breeze beside a Shinto shrine on the major freeway leading from Honolulu to Pearl Harbor. Just five miles away is the spot where Japanese planes dropped their bombs on the American fleet. Few tourists rushing between Pearl Harbor and Waikiki realize the deep irony that flag symbolizes. But for those who fought in World War II or know the history of that encounter, the sight of an American flag at a shrine so closely associated with the adversary calls forth a whole complex of reactions. It was Shinto, the native religion of Japan, that had not only given its wholehearted support to the war machine but had provided its very rationale: the myths and legends that led directly to the kamakazi pilots. Shinto taught that the emperor was a descendant of the very gods who had created their islands and that Japan thus had a mandate to rule the “world under one roof” (Hakko Ichiu). The idea that such a religion could ever find a home in America would have seemed preposterous in the 1940s. In fact, at the close of the war one of the arguments used against statehood for Hawaii was that the Japanese population in Hawaii was so great and their loyalties so questionable that it would be risky to include them in our commonwealth. Suspicion about the Japanese was building up long before Pearl Harbor, of course. In the 1930s, when Japan was invading China, Japanese women solicited funds on the streets of Honolulu for good-luck headbands for the soldiers. Imported films glorified Japan’s conquests; when Hankow and Canton fell, victory services were held in Shinto shrines in Hawaii. The emperor’s birthday was celebrated each year, and it was rumored that the Shinto god of war, Hachiman, was worshiped in one of Honolulu’s shrines. Once Hawaii was attacked, all of this changed. Japanese leaders, including Shinto priests, were rounded up and deported. It was impossible to resettle all of the Japanese, as California had done, for they constituted nearly one-third of the population. The people of Hawaii simply had to learn to live together despite their qualms. Suspicions continued for a while: Shinto shrines were considered a hotbed of subversive activities by some and were vandalized; Japanese maids were thought to be spies; Japanese fishermen were believed to have directed the pilots of the emperor to their targets. Nisei (second-generation Japanese) were eager to allay such suspicions. The 100th Reserve Officers Training Corps unit at the University of Hawaii was eager to fight in the war and prove that Japanese were loyal citizens of the territory. They soon got their opportunity as part of the much-decorated 442nd Battalion (all Japanese) that fought in Italy and France and, on VE Day, led the parade of Allied Forces.

There seems to be a groundswell of right wing nitwittery around the idea that there is something terribly wrong with the US Constitution, specifcally the 14th amendment. Apparently there are some real America haters that want to repeal parts of the 14th amendment. Do the right wingers here support these ideas, or are you all writing and calling your elected officials to tell them to cut the crap? Funny that one of the people who has been quoted is the child of an illegal Australian immigant. He ended up a citizen due to the 14th, but wants to screw over other people in similar situations. That makes him a good republican, as best I can tell...

Do you not understand the legal concept that civil rights are not subject to a popular vote? The rights exist and and cannot be taken away by a majority vote. That is what the ruling says, in no uncertain terms. If a majority could remove rights, segregation would still be legal in many states. That is the difference between a country that is governed by a well thought out Constitution and a legal system that enforces the Constitution, sometimes to the consternation of some citizens, and a true democracy. In a true democracy, majority rules, always. That isn't the case in the USA. When something is unconstitutional, the majority does NOT get their way. Just out of curiosity, how do you feel about "majority rules" in the Senate? As of right now, the Rescums have abused the filibuster to prevent majority rules in the Senate. They are forcing almost everything to require sixty votes, not 51, by abusing the rules as currently written. Totally wong, both ethically and morally, but that doesn't matter to the Rescums and their supporters. The same assholes don't like the Constitution anymore and want to rescind an amendment or two. Where are the howls of outrage from the right wing patriots who LOVE the Constitution and the amendments so much? The silence is deafening...

Ignorant bigoted assholes voted in favor of keeping the laws against inter-racial marriage in effect in California in the sixties. Fortunately, "an individual wearing a black robe" found that to be unconstitutional, even though the proposition passed by a fair margin. Ignorant bigoted assholes in many southern states voted to keep laws that sustained the "seperate but equal" treatment of non-whites. Fortunately, "an individual wearing a black robe" found that to be unconstitutional, even though the laws were very popular among the voters and passed by a wide margin. Ignorant bigoted assholes fought long and hard to prevent women from having the right to vote. It took until 1920 for women to get the right to vote. Ignorant bigoted assholes fought long and hard to prevent unmarried adult women from owning property in their own names. It wasn't until the mid-sixties that these laws were overturned by "an individual wearing a black robe". The laws were very popular among the voters. In each of the cases cited above, all sorts of bullshit justifications were used to deny basic civil rights to a group. The most offensive justifications by far is the biblical crap spewed by the religious zealots. Denying basic civil rights on the basis of a vote is 100% wrong. You folks would know better, if you really understood what this country is supposed to stand for.

The lying shitweasels know as ShrubCo sold the tax breaks for the extremely wealthy as a TEMPORARY situaution to "give us our money back" when they had a budget surplus. Now the right wing toadies for the rich are trying to extend the tax breaks, even though the promise was made to have them expire as scheduled. Lying shitweasels = Republicans and their supporters. Haven't you assholes managed to fuck over the regular people of this country enough already? Now you want to do more? What the hell is wrong with you? Why do you HATE the USA so much?

More right wingnut "scare the crap out of the ignorant" with a load of bullshit. Nothing to see here. Move along. The right wingnuts are all skeered of the latest Faux News bogeyman. Last week is was the New Black Panther Party, aka, a small group of loudmouths who got wall to wall coverage, much like Natalie Hollaway. This week is is those awful tax raising, baby murdering liberals who are at it again. You too can jump on the bandwagon if you are a lazy right wing follower who can parrot the latest talking points. Don't bother to try to understand what you copy and paste. Just DO IT!

To me, the racism is bad, but NOT the worst thing about the recordings. What I find to be the worst thing is the sexist part of the rant. Telling Oksana what she can and can't wear, boasting about how he makes the money so he'll call the shots, etc, is all very old school sexist pig crap that no self respecting modern woman would tolerate. Or should tolerate, for that matter. No one has had anything to say about the horrible attitude that Mel has towrads women. Everyone seems focused on the racism. He is getting a pass on the sexism. That is wrong. WAY wrong.

Nope, straight from the actual non-discrimination policy in question: shall not discriminate unlawfully on the basis of race, color, religion, national origin, ancestry, disability, age, sex or sexual orientation. Discriminating by skills still appears to be allowed. And a Gay person does not have the skill to live by the bible, If they practice their sexuality! The concept that one could live by a book of ancient superstitions is pretty fucking funny. That any sane person could choose this as a desirable goal is awesomely hilarious. I interpret the part of the bible that reads "Lo, I am with you" as a clear message to all pilots that you're on your own above 500' AGL. The bible is subject to many interpretations, all of which are dependent on the reader's preconcieved biases. Biblical passages have been used to support slavery, segregation, denial of women's rights, and murder of the un-believers, among other things. It is very creepy what the "true believers" do, or want to do, on the basis of an ancient book of superstitions.

I don't recall your outrage when Bush was gushing money out of the national treasury during the boom time before his recession hit, when he should have been saving a surplus handed to him by his predecessor. How convenient when everyone who parrots this line forgets about a little thing that happened on 9/11 Tha premeditated invasion and occupation of Iraq had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11. The events on 9/11 were cynically used to sell the Iraq invasion to a gullible public. There was a fair bit of opposition to the occupation as the facts were clear that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. Those protests were drowned out by rush to war. Get your historical FACTS correct. ShubCo executed the PNAC plan that well pre-dated the events of 9/11. Look up PNAC, spend some time reading, and shudder in horror as the realization comes that the rescumlicans executed the plan. The results were BAD. Really bad. And the fuckers CUT TAXES in a time of war, thus producing the worst financial dsiaster since the Great Depression. That is why they are rescumlicans, and will be referred to as such. The scumbags that supported them unquestioningly are as filthy and morally bankrupt as the rescumlicans themselves.

What can you expect when the rescumlicans that got us into this mess masively watered down and weakened the bill? A better outcome? The folks that support the rescumlicans don't care. As long as the "socialist" administration is stymied at every turn, all is good with the world, even if it ruins the country. We aren't going to get anything even close to what is needed. There is too much money in play, and zero concern for the good of the country. Allow me to point out the obvious - all of the politicians are deeply in the pockets of big business. They have to be, To run a campaign, all of the scumbags have to raise about 25 thousand dollars a day, on average. The average is going to increase as dirtbags like Meg and Carly buy their way into elections with their own money. We get the government that we have because most people are very gullible. The same assholes and techniques that sell soap and automobiles sell politicians. We get what we deserve as we are letting it happen.

It sure looks like the rescumlican obstruction of EVERYTHING that the current administration tries to do is working as well as they could have hoped. Not only is the housing market all fucked up, now the long term unemployed will lose their unemployment checks due to the rescum obstruction of the jobs bill. That clearly will help the children, promote reduced crime and greater stability in our communities, and best of all, teach those lazy fuckers to get off their asses and take ANY job they can, even if it pays less than minimum wage and has no health benefits. It doesn't matter that even these jobs don't exist. It makes for good sound bites, and that is all that really matters in an election year. When it comes to economic stimulus, giving money to unemployed citizens puts that money right back into the economy. They will spend it on stuff like rent, food, bills, etc. The rescums would much rather give the money to banks and hand out MORE TAX CUTS to the extremely wealthy. Good work, rescumlicans and supporters of the rescumlicans. You have much to be proud of. Thanks for helping drive this country into the toilet. We really appreciate it. Since when does it take sixty votes to pass a bill through the senate? This is happening because the rescums are filibustering EVERYTHING. That is a gross abuse of the filibuster process. The rescums should be shamed into stopping that bullshit by an intense media barrage that highlights the disgusting abuse of the process. That isn't going to happen due to the corporate ownership of the mass media. There is no liberal mass media. There never was. That is a fiction made up and sold to the gullible like soap is to housewives.

You clearly don't actually read all the posts on here. I have read every post in this thread, as well as the bullshit from the compassionless conservatives in the anti illegal immigration threads. The common theme is that enforcement of the law is absolute only against those that are not white and not of northern european ancestry. I despise hateful racist assholes, expecially when they advocate 1st degree murder, and the casual infliction of pain and suffering on those nasty "illegals". The nice grandma got herself caught up in the legal system. She committed the crrime and must do the time. There is no "grey area" when it comes to law enforcemaent, IF you are a right wing conservative. Me, I would expect that a decent legal system operated by reasonable people who aren't blinded by conservative ideaology would figure out a way to let granny resolve her mistake without overly harsh punishment. As she is NOT in the US legal system, she has a prayer...

If it was a conservatard like the non-maverick McCain you would support them 100%. Instead you support a disgusting example of partisan bullshit. Thanks to you and your kind, the country is going downhill in a hurry. I hope your kids and grandkids are working hard to learn Mandarin and Cantonese so that they can function in the world you folks are working hard to set up.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Just like with ALL laws, there is no grey area. You do the crime, you do the time. That is how a right wing conservative answers this type of question, isn't it? Oh, shit, I'm sorry, she is a white person of northern European ancestry. That means she gets a pass, as she really didn't mean to break the law, and absolute application of the law only applies to brown and yellow people. It most certainly does NOT apply to normal whites folks, if it was an honest mistake. No sireee, bub.