EBSB52

funny i heard the same bather about Regan. Not everyone thinks that Regan was a great President. Most of what we hear about him is post-funeral bandwagon media hype. What stands out most about the Regan administration for me? Iran/Contra. I put Regan's "I don't recall" right up there with "I did not have sexual relations with...," "No new taxes," "I am not a crook," and just about anything that came out of GW's mouth. Yep. I think of the corporatization of the US when I think of Reagan. I think of teh busting of the Airline Labor Unions, the Air Traffic Controllers, mandatory insurance, mandatory seat belts, and the general start of Fascism. But Iran-Contra is also very vivid and "I don't recall" is as pathetic as asking what the definition of "is" is.

There are a lot of conservatives crossing over. I guess it's typical since the pendulum has swung to the right for so long. Things like the Patriot Act, the Overtime Law, the Bankruptcy Law, the recent corporate property forfeiture, and many more conservative stringent acts/laws proposed and/or passed/signed by this pres are turning the pendulum back. As for your GF dying, I'm sorry for you and your family; sounds like an honorable man. One thing I see that is non-partisan is that people tend to become more conscious of their sympathies as they grow older. I think this is evidenced by many US Sup Ct Justices like O'Connor, Warren, even Breyer and Stevens to a degree. I guess heh key is to make the changes before you die so you can make an impact. I think people get so hung up in the fight of earning money and buying bigger and bigger houses that they think revoking all social programs will make a difference in their taxes and overall wealth. You get old and realize you can't take it with you and move for changes. I like Freud's, "Id, ego, and superego" theories here. I think they explain the life of a person from youth to adulthood.

I don't see that..... vigorously defending their pet politician.

Greenie bail-out once again....

I'm not sure why you're glad of it. I'm hardly putting you in a flattering light. I got it right off the bat...... Hmmm, I guess write more slowly

OK, you first.

HUH? Do they cater to fun jumpers now, as in licensed jumpers from other DZ's? I don't think so unless things have changed. Experienced Jumpers Due to various reasons, we are currently unable to accomodate any out-of-town experienced jumpers. We apologize for any inconvenience. Ou-of-state? Do they let jump in staters? I thought you had to learn there or no jump there..... hmmm, any insight?

Only a stupid Government would expose its people to more risk than is needed. Even larger, only a stupid careless Commander would expose his troops to more danger than needed. Yes, you send troops to bad places where they could get hurt WHEN IT FITS A MISSION. Going to London to hit the Pub is not mission, and American soldiers are targets. Your inability to understand the difference in Military matters is showing again. I didn't make it about the troops he did by saying: You may wish we send people into harms way for no reason....I don't. There was no good to be gained by having American troops walking around London. It only risked them, and people near them. It was a MILITARY call, and standard SOP in such a situation. YOU quit using any opportunity to slam the US...Why have you not moved yet? I think one person already offered you a deal to go...But you never responded to him. I'll show it again here so you can ignore it again. Hell there were even PM's about it. I'd like to see you buck up and take it since you claim to hate the US so much but seem to be afraid to leave it. Only a stupid Government would expose its people to more risk than is needed. So I guess we were atupid gov in Viet Nam. I guess we are being a stupid gov now in Iraq - war entered to upon false pretense, no real permantent good being accomplished. Even larger, only a stupid careless Commander would expose his troops to more danger than needed. Yes, you send troops to bad places where they could get hurt WHEN IT FITS A MISSION. OK< the Commander in Chimp is stupid then for the above reasons. Mission, that's incredibly subjective. Going to London to hit the Pub is not mission, and American soldiers are targets. That's your fragmented interpretation of the order. How about going into the public to defend them - show presence, show no fear as in being in the streets when not on duty? Your inability to understand the difference in Military matters is showing again. Ahhhh, does that make you feel better? YOU quit using any opportunity to slam the US...Why have you not moved yet? You're right, Constitutionally protected dissent is only for patriots, those who don't like the Constitution should be angered by people using such doctrine as the basis for which to openly dissent. Why have I not moved yet? If you actually read my posts you would see that I'm still in school. I think one person already offered you a deal to go...But you never responded to him. Hmmm, could that be due to me being bogusly banned. My, you do read all the pertinent threads, don't you? How could I avoid such a thread when I was banned - I must be a chicken. The person was guy that just signed on with no real proof that he is a skydiver or maybe he's a skydiver that is sihned in under a different ISP. He offered 10k and a plane ticket anywhere to promise never to return. I should take him up on that since it would be unenforceable unless he had 10k to pursue it through the civil courts and then another 100k to collect if he ever got a judgment. Totally unenforceable if I left and occasionally returned. Either way it's a joke. I'd like to see you buck up and take it since you claim to hate the US so much but seem to be afraid to leave it. Show where I've written that I hate the US. Oh, another ill-conceived misinterpretation by you. I think the US is a POS in many ways, but I don't hate the country. It may be a situation where I leave the US and work overseas most of the time, but use the US as a tax base. I will need to learn the requirements of working overseas and what criteria establishes what I need to do. Or, I might find the right country for me and move there, then establish citizenship. I told the guy that made that symbolically ridiculous so-called offer the same thing. I told him if he weanted me to go now it would cost 250k. He said he was going to contact Limbaugh and others of the same ire to see if they could collect the money. I guess he doesn't realize that those guys just spew the crap for marketability and that most of them really don't believe 1/2 the crap they spew.

c'mon man, you're turning this thread from a justified critique of a mid level military commanders decision which has quite nasty political results into an open bashing on the US and their "Commander in Chimp". Mid level? Perhaps, but decisions are ultimately made from the top, so to include Bush’s decisions is fair and in line with the topic. This is the US that is stirring up shit and now running away from the point of impact, right? I don’t think I’ve broadened the scope to an unreasonable level. This has nothing to do with Bush or the US overall political system... why bring them up? All you do is cause the thread to degenerate into bitching about the US/"US Haters". In the end the original complaint is lost entirely. Overall political system? I see you want to broaden the scope now, but in your last sentence you want to narrow the scope to include just your issue - pick a side of the fence. OK, tangent police, where are you when we need you? And one can safely assume that they weren't polite pm's, either. And don't worry, we're all used to it. he's got an axe to grind and the blade is always aimed at conservatives. I wrote: Democracy is what our semi-literate commander in chimp uses as a device to justify his murders adn extortion of the taxpayers. Tcnelson introduced Democracy-based nations as being attacked; I merely rejected the notion that Democracy exclusively means anything like freedom, do-gooders, etc.. So your point is made by distracting the issue that I shouldn’t distract the issue. Just answer the points and quit trying to delegate the style of argument.

How would any group get the funding for such an endeavor? Oh yea, oil money from Saudi. And they are friends with Bush which means Bush is behind this just as he was behind 9/11, right? It's all just one big conspiracy for Bush to rule the world muhahahaha...... I didn't go there, but I guess it beats addressing the issue.

Thanks for saying that, Ron. I was stationed in Japan about 30 miles south of Hiroshima during the 30th anniversary of the atomic bombing. We were the closest U.S. military base (Iwakuni), and an annual anti-nuclear anti-U.S. protest was expected outside the base gates. Just to make sure there were no attacks on U.S. Marines, the base was buttoned up and we weren't allowed outside. That wasn't cowardice, by any means. It was just a prudent measure to avoid criminal trouble, political trouble, and international incidents. The Marines were more than willing to storm out there and kick the protestor's asses. That's what we keep saying, the troops aren't chickens, but US foreign war policy is oten cowardly, especially from the perspective of the other countries.

How would any group get the funding for such an endeavor? Oh yea, oil money from Saudi.

Actually, the US reaction to WW2 and it's slow entrance into the conflict is an interesting review of politics, propaganda and molding public opinion. Exactly! Hell, Germany invaded Poloand in Sep 39, Japan was raising hell in the Pacific aboutthe same time. Actually Japan was raising hell since WWI. I guess FDR used careful deliberation, as opposed this ass we have now.

to think that western societies would not be attacked unless the invasion of iraq happened is not only foolish, it's shows a failure to pay attention to what has happened over the last half century regarding terrorist activity. america and many other democracy-based nations have been attacked repeatedly by terrorists over the past 30 years for any number of societal and political reasons. Can we lose this concept that Democracy guarantees freedom and all things good? Nazi Germany was a Democracy. The US is a representative Democracy in which the election process is often questionable and votes can be overturned anyway, by means of corruption or conventionally by the US Sup Ct - medical marijuana - and many others..... Democracy is what our semi-litterate commander in chimp uses as a device to justify his murders adn extortion of the taxpayers.

Let's use a time in history when the US was a noble country to justify our lack of nobility now......

Totally agree, and to expound, gas prices seem to double when we are over there in their business..... All these wars in teh Middle East do is to 1. make US corps filthy rich 2. Kill innocent kids 3. Kill innocent foreigners 4. did I say make US corps filthy rich? 5. remind the world of what will happen to them if they disagree with the US 6. Create world hate for teh US ...... all missions accomplished......

It is pretty common to "close up" right after an attack nearby. This is normal and smart. The soldiers were told not to go to London. They still did their jobs. The soldiers didn't "fear to tread". They were told not to go. They followed orders. The orders were normal protocal. From what I have been told they have already been lifted. Most people if smart would not walk into the lions mouth unless they had to. Shame on you for slamming people who did their jobs and followed orders. Shame on you for jumping all over people without all the info. Most people if smart would not walk into the lions mouth unless they had to. But a brave government would do so, especially after going to another continent and tugging on the lion's tail; a cowardly government, or one that has its own agenda would watch from afar tho. Shame on you for slamming people who did their jobs and followed orders. Quit making this aboutthe troops; it's about the gov and you know that's what people are sayinghere.

Please, this thread isn't about the incident, it's about how we shouldn't name the site - pls stay on topic. J/K

Where do you think the media comes 1st for info? Old newspaper clippings and the odd news site with archives, or a BASE /skydiving site? I think I made it pretty clear that the rule against initial disclosure of sites on DZ.com is a good one for exactly the reason you made (and for reasons of BASE ethics). My point is that deleting a reference to a site in an outside media source is somewhat shallow if the link to the story is included, and the name of the site can be accessed by a mouse click to the outside media source. Its style over substance and doesn't accomplish the intended result. If DZ.com wants to prevent this site from being used to desseminate site names, don't allow people to post the URLs of outside sources which name sites. Edited for tardness. I totally agree, but it's easier to omit it to keep the witchhunt away. Geez, I was trying to post immediate info from something that occurred in my backyard, but I was persecuted.

Which is pretty silly. I understand the rationale of DZ.com not being the initial source of a site name, but when it's already been divulged, editing a site name out of a secondary source doesn't make much sense. The less people that know it, the less of a chance there is for some idiot to go try their first BASE jump there and kill themselves there, fucking things up for EVERYBODY, especially themselves. Doesn't seem silly to me at all. example from The World BASE Fatality List: #51 Christopher Kennedy, December 2,1997 Age: 35 Antenna Jump Tucson, Arizona USA Impact Christopher is dead when his feet leave the tower is what other jumpers said after this fatality. Using a skydiving rig not modified for BASE, and without any prior BASE training or experience, he climbed 364-feet up a 450-foot tower and jumped only to find his bungee controlled collapsible pilot chute didn't work well at slow airspeeds. A passer-by found Kennedy's body near the tower the next morning. He had pulled his reserve handle at some point prior to impact. Alcohol may have been a contributing factor in this fatality. I understand that we shouldn't post the site, but jackasses that downsize to a loading of 1.6+ and do hook turns at 78 jumps, or those who base jump at 0 skydives or with very few are going to do it regardless of info/advice. There was that guy in Russia who used his skydiving rig and I think there may have been booze involved - been a while since I read it. Info is for people who want to learn and who want to be careful - ignorance is for people who make for good reading.

I would never call anybody and havent called anybody who is sick and needs help a freeloader. Maybe I need to go back and re-word somethings. I'm speaking about the ones who never put anything in and are not sick and able to work but choose to suck off the system. I'm speaking about the ones who never put anything in and are not sick and able to work but choose to suck off the system. You mean like babies born with AIDS? God Damned freeloaders - never put anything in and now they want to live. Now if they coyld dunk a BBall, well, they would be certainly worthy of med help. I could go back and build a library where you 180'd yourself on your positions once a real live person, a military veteran that has put more into this country in his life than most Republihaters on this board could ever conceive of, but I don't think I need to. I'm 43 and I started college 10 years ago with a mentality like yours. I'm an Air Force veteran and I was a registered Repugnican, still am actualy, but I was so-called liberalized after Icould no longer keep the facade of bullshit lies propagated by the whitey-righties (BTW I am white - I didn't mean that in a skin color context) going; Ihad to concede to the truth. Again, you are a young kid, keep your opinions with a grain of salt because you may 180 them at the drop of a hat. This attitude of intollerance will likely haunt you at one time in your life if you live long enough and you may become very liberal. Ray Krone, guy that spent 3 years on AZ death row and 7 more in GP for a murder he didin't commit, after 2 trials which he was convicted both times, was pro-cap pun and pro intollerance in general, is now an advocate for the opposite. Just relax your hate / intollerance for the poor / ill / needy, as you may become one at some point. Last question and pls answer: If all the "needless" welfare were discontinued, would your taxes be reduced? With the courts allocating all the power to corps, as they can now take your house for private corp needs, do you think the courts are on our side? With the so-called war and furloughing 1 billion per week to Haliburton and the sort, don't you think the gov would find another way to spend the $$ that were saved from not having, "giveaways?" Answer those.

Good for you! No one should feel guilty about collecting SSDI for legitimate reasons. You've paid into the system and now you need its benefit. SSDI is not a free handout like other 'entitlements' (of course other entitlements can be legitimate also). It's when these programs are abused that pisses people off. As you said, you're fighting a disease and feel like shit daily. Accept your SSDI and don't think twice about it. Hang in there, and I will keep you in my prayers. People like you deserve our compassion, not our critcism. Chris This pots is about welfare / entitlements / gov benefits for the needy and not about anyone. Funny how some scream like crazy when the welfare mother with a kid in each arm and 1 in the oven gets food stamps, yet whne corps get unfair breaks the answers are: 1. Corps need to make a profit 2. It's unfair to impede commerce 3. W/o corps we would all be in trouble 4. If we don't give cops breaks, they will pull upo and do business overseas (truth is the gov can place tarriffs and restrictions so they can't do that) But when our current murderer in chief wants to start a war on unfounded merit (WMD's), and we need victims to go fight this crap, who do we turn to???? Uh, welfare mom, can you slide us a baby or three to go die for Haliburton's 100's of millions and this lame concept of patriotism? System of a Down, BYOB talks of, "Why do they send the Poor" which is a direct statement of this. In the US we are taught to hate anyone poorer than we are; this is a byproduct of Capitalism. In schools we teach kids that grading on a curve is beneficial, so if you are around inferior people you will do better. I had a professor from Italy and he said they would degrade you as k-12 student there if you failed to work with several kids around you. The idea in Socialist-based countries is that if you're selfish you willbe downgraded - in the US it's advantageous to to do better than the people around you - compete with and destriy everyone is how it morphs out in real life as adults.

He claims he would, truth is screamers never fight, and fighters never scream. Could be littleman complex - big truck / small cock..... essesentially compensation. Besides, Rhino is a closet burner..... thou protests too loudly.....

Courts have always been able to do anything. "Legal" is anything that a judge says it is. "Right and wrong" have little to that. Courts have always been able to do anything. Onr more thing, that places a representative Democracy several rungs below a Monarchy or other forms of gov, right? When I hear chimp running his pie hole about Democracy, I think of WWII Germany and Hitler, I also think of modern-day US.

Courts have always been able to do anything. "Legal" is anything that a judge says it is. "Right and wrong" have little to that. Actually those are not my words - they are the words of whomever I quoted, I think lawrocket. I agree with them, but I didn't write them.