free_man

Good vid, but they forgot the assholes on the other side of the isle. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Quote In no way does violating the unalienable rights of the Citizens justifiable because you detect or reveal plots or crimes. I disagree. But hey...everyone has an opinion. ____________________________________________________ If you believe in collectivism (communism,socialism,fascism) it is justifiable or necessary. These are not the principles America was founded upon. America was founded upon personal rights, and the ownership of private property. I own myself, the state does not. My uanalienable rights come from the Creator as our forefathers stated in the Declaration of Independence, not from any government or state, and they have absolutely no authority to violate them. Amendment IV "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Slaves are controlled, numbered tracked and traced not free people. Most people today would probably choose slavery over freedom, even if they did know the difference. After all, freedom is harder - it requires full unlimited responsibility and accountability for one's life. Most people today are too lazy to be free. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Huge but neccessary. There are hundreds of plots and crimes of all kinds detected and revealed by Echelon. Some I can not post on a message board but there are many I can. It is definitly something we need to have continue to happen. __________________________________________ In no way does violating the unalienable rights of the Citizens justifiable because you detect or reveal plots or crimes. Not in a free nation, based on the rule of law and not the rule of man. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Post: In Reply To What moron congressman would vote for a draft bill prior to the election? Political suicide. This was just to pacify the sheeple. Watch what happens after election and in january after inauguration. Oh, how about voting for a candidate who is against the war, have to vote third party though, wonder why? So when a Republican doesn't say he's against the draft, he's for it. When a Republican casts a vote to NOT reinstitute a draft, he isn't really against it -- he's just posing for an election campaign. Liberals really don't see the hypocrisy of their insistence on having it both ways. Apparently, there is NOTHING Republicans can do to satisfy the liberals that they don't want a draft. If they keep their mouths shut, they are accused of secretly wanting to do it. If they VOTE in CONGRESS to not do it, they are insincere. I think it's time that Republicans gave up trying to convince liberals of their good intentions because liberals never believe them, and won't ever concede anything in good faith. -Jeffrey _____________________________________ Where do I state anything about Republicans or liberals? Any of them that would vote for a draft bill prior to election would be committing political suicide. Rarely will we see any controversial, partisan legisiation prior to an election. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

*** Comment Name Wittheld 10-8-4 This "earpiece" nonesense was making me crazy, so I contacted a friend who is on the job with the Secret Service. The pure and simple answer to this ludicrous accusation is that this device is nothing more than a location-transponder and panic button with which the President may notify the Secret Service of an emergency and vice versa. Should this be wrong, I promise on my word of honor to eat all my hats. All of them. Even the one made of leather soaked in mad cow juice. Read this here: Bush's Earpiece - Audiogate - What We Know So Far http://www.rense.com/general58/ear.htm “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

http://atomfilms.shockwave.com/af/spotlight/collections/mock_vote/ “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Post: >When it could issue whatever amounts of currency it needs directly from >its own treasury, without interest. And the dollar will plummet like a stone compared to other countries. Currencies, much like commodities, follow the laws of supply and demand. If there are way more US dollars, and the same demand for them, their value will decline. Exactly what is happening now only worse because of the interest. The Fed enables Congress to spend the next couple of generations' money. The political implications of creating massive amounts of bonded debt are not felt until years later. If Congress did not have this ability, but could only issue currency, the issuance of large amounts would cause an inflation that would be political suicide for them. This is why the Constitution states: Article I. Section 8 "The Congress shall have Power To coin money, regulate the Value thereof," “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

http://www.gunowners.org/a100404.htm Monday, October 4, 2004 What part of "Constitution" don't they understand? In a frightening move, House Republicans -- members of the party that supposedly favors "limited government" -- are pushing an Orwellian nightmare in Congress in the name of "national security." In the wake of the 9/11 Commission's recommendations, the Senate -- unlike the House -- has prepared legislation which would closely track that Commission's findings by reorganizing the intelligence services in the federal government. The Senate bill is relatively innocuous compared to the House version, HR 10. Unfortunately, many of the so-called Republicans in the House are pushing this nightmarish legislation which would: * Create a massive government database containing personal information on every American man, woman and child; * Standardize (i.e., nationalize) the process of issuing driver's licenses -- thereby taking the final step toward creating a national ID card; and * Set up a system whereby any employer or industry identified by the Attorney General would have to submit employment applicants to the government for approval -- complete with fingerprints or other "biometric identifiers." Now, let's look at how each of these problems could affect your rights -- gun rights in particular: read here: http://www.gunowners.org/a100404.htm “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

The Department of Treasury calls up the US Mint and declares that the Federal Reserve has expressed the need for "X" amount of notes to be printed. Since that money is backed by no precious metals, reduction of the value of printed money already in circulation will occur in relationship to the face value of the new money created. The Bureau of Engraving and Printing prints the money. The Federal Reserve then buys the bills from the United States Mint for 234 dollars per 1000 notes (any denomination) Next, they deposit this money at face value into their own account. They then buy US Treasury obligations such as T-Bills, T-Bonds, and T-Notes and pay the money they just received right back to the US Department of Treasury, which spends it into the economy. The Federal Reserve Banks, previously having nothing, now have the full face value of the money printed in their account. Additionally, they will receive the interest which will be paid on this money. Inflation is the act of increasing the money supply. Rising prices are a result of inflation. The flaw in the present system is that our Government has been convinced that it is normal for a nation to borrow its national currency, and pay interest, to a private bank. When it could issue whatever amounts of currency it needs directly from its own treasury, without interest. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

*** I wasn't far into the site when I realized the author's writing skills aren't very good. He must be a victim of the very system he's trying to expose. That's too bad you may have learned something. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Free Market Medicine Last week the congressional Joint Economic committee on which I serve held a hearing featuring two courageous medical doctors. I had the pleasure of meeting with one of the witnesses, Dr. Robert Berry, who opened a low-cost health clinic in rural Tennessee. His clinic does not accept insurance, Medicare, or Medicaid, which allows Dr. Berry to treat patients without interference from third-party government bureaucrats or HMO administrators. In other words, Dr. Berry practices medicine as most doctors did 40 years ago, when patients paid cash for ordinary services and had inexpensive catastrophic insurance for serious injuries or illnesses. As a result, Dr. Berry and his patients decide for themselves what treatment is appropriate. Freed from HMO and government bureaucracy, Dr. Berry can focus on medicine rather than billing. Operating on a cash basis lowers his overhead considerably, allowing him to charge much lower prices than other doctors. He often charges just $35 for routine maladies, which is not much more than one’s insurance co-pay in other offices. His affordable prices enable low-income patients to see him before minor problems become serious, and unlike most doctors, Dr. Berry sees patients the same day on a walk-in basis. Yet beyond his low prices and quick appointments, Dr. Berry provides patients with excellent medical care. While many liberals talk endlessly about medical care for the poor, Dr. Berry actually helps uninsured people every day. His patients are largely low-income working people, who cannot afford health insurance but don’t necessarily qualify for state assistance. Some of his uninsured patients have been forced to visit hospital emergency rooms for non-emergency treatment because no doctor would see them. Others disliked the long waits and inferior treatment they endured at government clinics. For many of his patients, Dr. Berry’s clinic has been a godsend. Dr. Berry’s experience illustrates the benefits of eliminating the middleman in health care. For decades, the U.S. healthcare system was the envy of the entire world. Not coincidentally, there was far less government involvement in medicine during this time. America had the finest doctors and hospitals, patients enjoyed high quality, affordable medical care, and thousands of private charities provided health services for the poor. Doctors focused on treating patients, without the red tape and threat of lawsuits that plague the profession today. Most Americans paid cash for basic services, and had insurance only for major illnesses and accidents. This meant both doctors and patients had an incentive to keep costs down, as the patient was directly responsible for payment, rather than an HMO or government program. We should remember that HMOs did not arise because of free-market demand, but rather because of government mandates. The HMO Act of 1973 requires all but the smallest employers to offer their employees HMO coverage, and the tax code allows businesses- but not individuals- to deduct the cost of health insurance premiums. The result is the illogical coupling of employment and health insurance, which often leaves the unemployed without needed catastrophic coverage. While many in Congress are happy to criticize HMOs today, the public never hears how the present system was imposed upon the American people by federal law. In fact, one very prominent Senator now attacking HMOs is on record in the 1970s lauding them. As usual, government intervention in the private market failed to deliver the promised benefits and caused unintended consequences, but Congress never blames itself for the problems created by bad laws. Instead, we are told more government- in the form of “universal coverage”- is the answer. We can hardly expect more government to cure our current health care woes. As with all goods and services, medical care is best delivered by the free market, with competition and financial incentives keeping costs down. When patients spend their own money for health care, they have a direct incentive to negotiate lower costs with their doctor. When government controls health care, all cost incentives are lost. Dr. Berry and others like him may one day be seen as consumer heroes who challenged the third-party health care system and resisted the trend toward socialized medicine in America. Ron Paul - R TX, OBGYN http://www.house.gov/paul/tst/tst2004/tst050304.htm “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Read this: http://deliberatedumbingdown.com/ “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

What moron congressman would vote for a draft bill prior to the election? Political suicide. This was just to pacify the sheeple. Watch what happens after election and in january after inauguration. Oh, how about voting for a candidate who is against the war, have to vote third party though, wonder why? “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

"but you imply that there is no truth or freedom in our society because the government and anyone who participates in government or the military lies all the time, about everything, to everyone." I did not imply this you presume it. "Is there not one honest person out there who will or has stepped forward and do what is best for our country?" Good question, I doubt any will be found in leadership positions of the gov't. (doesn't mean all gov't is corrupt) "For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst and provide for it." Patrick Henry “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

My first post was in reply to "Why the Vietnam War was Fought" and "the war against communism was not entirely wrong as most liberals would have you believe." Thread definitely has taken on a new life. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Do not care to get into personal attacks, and stupid, childish arguments that frequently occur on forums so I prefer to be anonymous. No troll, I think you should re read my post and look into what I have stated, resources are there. I have posted books, and names to research, no inuendo. All to often disinformation tactics on these forums are used when people can not refute information. ####################################### 1) Avoidance. They never actually discuss issues head-on or provide constructive input, generally avoiding citation of references or credentials. Rather, they merely imply this, that, and the other. Virtually everything about their presentation implies their authority and expert knowledge in the matter without any further justification for credibility. 2) Selectivity. They tend to pick and choose opponents carefully, either applying the hit-and-run approach against mere commentators supportive of opponents, or focusing heavier attacks on key opponents who are known to directly address issues. Should a commentator become argumentative with any success, the focus will shift to include the commentator as well. 3) Coincidental. They tend to surface suddenly and somewhat coincidentally with a new controversial topic with no clear prior record of participation in general discussions in the particular public arena involved. They likewise tend to vanish once the topic is no longer of general concern. They were likely directed or elected to be there for a reason, and vanish with the reason. 4) Teamwork. They tend to operate in self-congratulatory and complementary packs or teams. Of course, this can happen naturally in any public forum, but there will likely be an ongoing pattern of frequent exchanges of this sort where professionals are involved. Sometimes one of the players will infiltrate the opponent camp to become a source for straw man or other tactics designed to dilute opponent presentation strength. 5) Anti-conspiratorial. They almost always have disdain for 'conspiracy theorists' and, usually, for those who in any way believe JFK was not killed by LHO. Ask yourself why, if they hold such disdain for conspiracy theorists, do they focus on defending a single topic discussed in a NG focusing on conspiracies? One might think they would either be trying to make fools of everyone on every topic, or simply ignore the group they hold in such disdain. Or, one might more rightly conclude they have an ulterior motive for their actions in going out of their way to focus as they do. 6) Artificial Emotions. An odd kind of 'artificial' emotionalism and an unusually thick skin -- an ability to persevere and persist even in the face of overwhelming criticism and unacceptance. This likely stems from intelligence community training that, no matter how condemning the evidence, deny everything, and never become emotionally involved or reactive. The net result for a disinfo artist is that emotions can seem artificial. Most people, if responding in anger, for instance, will express their animosity throughout their rebuttal. But disinfo types usually have trouble maintaining the 'image' and are hot and cold with respect to pretended emotions and their usually more calm or unemotional communications style. It's just a job, and they often seem unable to 'act their role in character' as well in a communications medium as they might be able in a real face-to-face conversation/confrontation. You might have outright rage and indignation one moment, ho-hum the next, and more anger later -- an emotional yo-yo. With respect to being thick-skinned, no amount of criticism will deter them from doing their job, and they will generally continue their old disinfo patterns without any adjustments to criticisms of how obvious it is that they play that game -- where a more rational individual who truly cares what others think might seek to improve their communications style, substance, and so forth, or simply give up. 7) Inconsistent. There is also a tendency to make mistakes which betray their true self/motives. This may stem from not really knowing their topic, or it may be somewhat 'freudian', so to speak, in that perhaps they really root for the side of truth deep within. I have noted that often, they will simply cite contradictory information which neutralizes itself and the author. For instance, one such player claimed to be a Navy pilot, but blamed his poor communicating skills (spelling, grammar, incoherent style) on having only a grade-school education. I'm not aware of too many Navy pilots who don't have a college degree. Another claimed no knowledge of a particular topic/situation but later claimed first-hand knowledge of it. 8) BONUS TRAIT: Time Constant. Recently discovered, with respect to News Groups, is the response time factor. There are three ways this can be seen to work, especially when the government or other empowered player is involved in a cover up operation: 1) ANY NG posting by a targeted proponent for truth can result in an IMMEDIATE response. The government and other empowered players can afford to pay people to sit there and watch for an opportunity to do some damage. SINCE DISINFO IN A NG ONLY WORKS IF THE READER SEES IT - FAST RESPONSE IS CALLED FOR, or the visitor may be swayed towards truth. 2) When dealing in more direct ways with a disinformationalist, such as email, DELAY IS CALLED FOR - there will usually be a minimum of a 48-72 hour delay. This allows a sit-down team discussion on response strategy for best effect, and even enough time to 'get permission' or instruction from a formal chain of command. 3) In the NG example 1) above, it will often ALSO be seen that bigger guns are drawn and fired after the same 48-72 hours delay - the team approach in play. This is especially true when the targeted truth seeker or their comments are considered more important with respect to potential to reveal truth. Thus, a serious truth sayer will be attacked twice for the same sin. I close with the first paragraph of the introduction to my unpublished book, Fatal Rebirth: Truth cannot live on a diet of secrets, withering within entangled lies. Freedom cannot live on a diet of lies, surrendering to the veil of oppression. The human spirit cannot live on a diet of oppression, becoming subservient in the end to the will of evil. God, as truth incarnate, will not long let stand a world devoted to such evil. Therefore, let us have the truth and freedom our spirits require... or let us die seeking these things, for without them, we shall surely and justly perish in an evil world. ####################################### Lets see some intelligent factual proof, and info, no personal attacks, and disinformation. Fact: WAR is for profit. who profits? educate yourself, read War is a Racket. (Just one example.) Fact: CIA(OSS) involved in drug trade before Vietnam. (read about the history of the opium trade) Fact: Gov't story about Gulf of Tonkin incident was BS. Here just one resource article.(http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB132/essay.htm) I always ask myself 2 things when it comes to history and questionable events of the day. QUI BONO, Who benefits? and Follow the money. So here is a question, (maybe should be a new post, sorry.) Do you believe that the CIA is invovled in drug trafficking now and or in the past? “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Quote What if there were no taxes at all? Would that stimulate the economy? Hell no! >> Yes it would, it would force the criminals in DC to be fiscally responsible, and allow free markets to >> determine where the peoples' money is spent. We need an entirely new tax code in the USA that is fair and has no loopholes. >> The Income Tax is legalized theft (and a scam). Not one penny collected goes to pay for any >> programs. It goes to pay the interest on the debt. Congress has to rob SS, and borrow every year >> to function. It is also (Income Tax) the second plank of the communist manifesto. >> In the forties the fed chairman stated that taxes were no longer neccessary for revenue, but >> could be used to redistribute the wealth.

QuoteAnd I am asking to see the research that you keep referring to and all you give me is jumk without support. >>I have provided you with resources, there are plenty more, it is up to you to research them, where >>are your resources? >>The facts are that the CIA was involved in drug trafficking in the golden triangle, prior to the >>Vietnam War, and still are. >>Mao had shut down most of the drug trafficking in China, the french and the CIA needed drugs and >>cultivated drug production in the Golden Triangle. In 1962 The US ended operations in Laos, but >>the CIA moved its covert drug trade to Thailand and continued to fly supplies, and drugs between >>Laos, Thailand and Vietnam. Some they supported were fighting communists, some were >>communists. >>You stated that: Why the Vietnam War was fought Although we entered the war under false circumstances (Gulf of Tonkin Incident) and allowed corruption to run rampant at all levels, the war against communism was not entirely wrong as most liberals would have you believe. >>Gov't story of Gulf of Tonkin was BS, I think we agree. >>My facts are that the Vietnam War, was fought for profits, (like all wars) cost $150 billion dollars, >>(and the off the books profit came from the drugs in Vietnam), and the control of the drug trade >>that they were heavily involved in long before the war. (read WAR IS A RACKET) >>The CIA also used the American Mafia as well as the Corsican Mafia in their drug trafficking. >>The SE Asia drug trade also served as a model for Central and South America. >>Governments always use ideologies, like fighting communism, national security, spreading >>democracy, as guises and staged incidents, and false threats as propaganda to gain public >>support. >>Do some research on George Frederick Hegel, the Hegelian Dialectic. Thesis, Antithesis, Synthesis, >>also called Problem, Reaction, Solution. Naturally, the common people don't want war ... but after all it is the leaders of a country who determine the policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in every country. - Hermann Goering, In War

Maybe this will help? *Republicrat vs. Democan* *MSNBC | October 1 2004 * Get past the bluster and bile, and the two products of privilege who each want to be the next President aren't all that different. How sad. Last night was Debate Night USA. Perhaps you tuned in. But what did America really see after months of endless campaigning, hundreds of millions of dollars lavished on attack ads, and enough cheap talk [as my mama used to say] to drive any sane citizen off the nearest bridge? Answer: Two flawed candidates -- George Walker Bush and John Forbes Kerry -- both of the same generation and privileged class, but who differ largely in style. Two representatives of the major-party duopoly that controls the debates, the political process, and the country. You don't agree? Let's look at the Tale of the Presidential Tape. Bush is 58. Kerry is 61. Both went to New England prep schools [Bush to Andover, from which both his father and Kerry's father graduated. Kerry to St. Paul's]. Both went to the same college [Yale]. Both joined the same secret society [Skull & Bones]. Both served in the military. Bush was an officer in the Air National Guard [a good way to avoid Vietnam combat]. Kerry was an officer in the U.S. Navy [usually a safer alternative than the Army in those days]. Kerry saw combat and became an antiwar activist after his discharge. Bush never served overseas, disengaged from the Guard after being trained as a pilot, and worked on the political campaign of a Bush family friend. Bush went to grad school [Harvard MBA]. Kerry went to law school [Boston College]. Bush, bankrolled with family money, pursued a largely unsuccessful career as an independent oilman. Then, again through family connections, he became a part-owner of the Texas Rangers baseball team. Kerry became a prosecutor. Both ran for Congress and were defeated. Bush was eventually elected governor of Texas, then President. Kerry was eventually elected Lt. Governor of Massachusetts, then U.S. senator. Both married and had two daughters. Kerry later had his marriage annulled and remarried. Bush was an Episcopalian, then a Presbyterian, and finally a Methodist [talk about flip-floppers]. Kerry is a Roman Catholic. Bush wears his religion on his sleeve. Kerry is more circumspect about his beliefs. Both are connected to political dynasties [Bush to the Bush Dynasty of his grandfather, Senator Prescott Bush, and his father, former President George H.W. Bush; Kerry to the Kennedy Dynasty, although his own ancestors include John Winthrop, the first governor of Massachusetts, and a great-great-grandfather who was a U.S. senator]. Bush runs, bikes, and clears brush. Kerry skis, bikes, and windsurfs. Both hunt [at least for the cameras]. Both are multimillionaires. Both are Washington insiders [Bush settled scores for his father from the White House; Kerry has been in the Senate for almost 20 years]. Both are the highly marketed and focus-group-targeted products of two competing political brands owned by Dems Inc. and GOP Inc. Corporate America has enormous equity stakes in both outfits. Neither, despite all the spin, is a regular guy. In fact, the only Presidential candidate with a national following who wasn't born with a silver microphone in his mouth is Ralph Nader. Of course, Nader wasn't allowed to participate in the debates, even though his candidacy in 2000 probably determined the outcome of the election. That's because the Commission on Presidential Debates is a jointly owned subsidiary of the Democratic and Republican parties, and squabble as they may, the last thing they want is to share their lucrative business with some political startup. Why, fresh ideas might be injected into the debate, and who knows where that would lead? “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Quote Hey, you read it on the internet on a "Hate Bush" site so it must be true, right? >> Just because something comes from a "Hate Bush" or a "Hate Kerry" site does not mean that it >> may not be true. >> Don't shoot the messanger. >> Read it, watch it, and decide for yourself. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Quote Anyone can name names and items that have been made into movies, but I asked for facts. Got any? Quote I never said US backed Ho Chi Minh against the french Nope you didn't say that, so what? Fact: CIA was trafficing drugs out of golden triangle prior to vietnam war. Do some research and discover the truth, I did not get names from any movie, I've done the research, I do not live in denial. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Saturday 2nd October 2004 : Bush Blows Debate: Talks to Rove in Earpiece! 9 comment(s). During the Presidential Debate Bush made what may be his most costly error- he exposed that he’s using an earpiece to help him answer debate questions. In the middle of an answer bush said, "now let me finish" as if someone was interrupting him - yet nobody did - he was talking to the person in his earpiece. read here: http://bellaciao.org/en/article.php3?id_article=3562 To watch go to C-span.org, fast forward debate to 40:30, who is he talking to? LOL

Quote US backed Vietnamese against the Japanese. Ho Chi Minh was part of the package, but the US did not back Ho against the French even if the the OSS wanted to. Get your history straight. >> I never said US backed Ho Chi Minh against the >> french, failed foreign policy backing him during >> WWII, as well as backing other drug warlords. Quote Please furnish me with provable facts if you can. I don't have to "believe" the govt story because I was there. Worked out of the Emassey annex in Nha Trang and have first hand experience. Flown by Air America many times. Where were you? >> Working out of the embassy, or flying on Air >> America does not prove anything. Other than you were there. >> I provided some resources above, here are some names to look into: >> General Khun Sa, Ted Shackley, Tom Clines, Richard Armitage, >> Richard Secord, Ollie North, General Vang Pao, Robert Jantzen, Richard Taus, >> See: >> The CIA trafficing heroin/opium out of Burma, Laos, and Thailand, the Golden Triangle, >> prior to Vietnam War. Supplying the drug warlords. >> The French Connection. >> The Corsican syndicates. >> War is for profit. In this case primarily drug profit. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

Quote Nope you are not even close. The US backed the Vietnam Nationalists which included many factions one of which was Ho Chi Minh's group. Prior to WWII's end, Ho quietly started killing off the coalition member leadership so that his party could take over. When Ho requested US assistance to oust the French after the war's end, the US decided to back it's ally France over the Nationalists. In effect, the US allowed France to reimpose colonialism over the Vietnamese. That was our mistake that cost 58,000 American lives and 3-4 million Vietnamese lives. >> This in no way proves it was about fighting communism. Bad foreign policy. US backed Ho Chi >> Minh. QuoteNope, wrong again. The US individuals participating in the war eventually succumbed to the corruption and dollars which over the years became more and more prevalent. However the Vietnam war was not fought for drugs and money by the governments involved. You have listened to Hollywood for to long. >> Corruption from the start remember Gulf of Tonkin. >> Every war is fought about money this is a historical FACT. Control of the drug trade by the >> CIA was a main reason. Believe the Gov't story if it makes you >> feel better, the facts are to the contrary. “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless

The Gov't story that Vietnam was about fighting communism is BS. During WWII The US backed Ho Chi Minh, sound a little like the same situation we are in now? Vietnam War was fought for drugs, and money. see WAR IS A RACKET! http://lexrex.com/enlightened/articles/warisaracket.htm Vietnam, the CIA's Illegal Drug Trafficking, and JFK's Assassination by Michael Collins Piper The Politics of Heroin: CIA Complicity in the Global Drug Trade by Alfred McCoy “…because I hope you know this, I think you do…all governments are lying cocksuckers.” Bill Hicks, Relentless