strop45

I know a few unlucky people. Try having the horse fall on top of you. I know a few such 'unlucky' people. Similarly ATVs are generally less inclined to fall over than motorbikes, but the extra weight does more damage. Overall I'm inclined to think that riding horses is safer than skydiving, and that riding motorbikes or ATVs is about the same risk as skydiving. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

The canopy has a certain vector associated with its flight, and yes wing loading generally just increases the magnitude of the vector. The wind also has a vector associated with it. If you want to know how a skydiver moves relative to a fixed object on the ground you must ADD the two vectors. Try this and you will see that a more heavily loaded canopy will make more progress upwind that a more lightly loaded one and vica-versa - a more lightly canopy will make more ground downwind than a more heavily loaded canopy. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

I also agree with Tonto, i.e. all of the above. The only proviso is that the actions of the operator are such and are at sufficient altitude to allow a controllable canopy to be deployed. For example an initial lineover followed by a cutaway too low to allow the reserve to fully inflate would meet one of the above definitions but would NOT IMO be a double malfunction. Similarly a no pull (with or without an AAD) isn't a double malfunction. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

No, and I have also never used my reserve, does that it mean it could be any old cheap thing? If I'm going to carry a hook-knife (and I do) I want it to be useful if I ever need to use it. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

And that's the problem - an absence of gun control laws has armed more of the above people than everyone else. If they want a gun to make crime easier, its no problem to get one (even legally). Everyone else then either has a gun or lives in the hope that they won't come across someone with one. So many criminals do honest/law abiding people shoot? - not as many as the accidental shootings, teenagers committing suicide etc etc etc. Its a real dilemma, I don't think strict gun control in the USA would do anything except empower the wrong people in the short term, but maybe thats the price for long-term peace-of-mind. As the criminals get more and more powerful weapons, does everyone else need the same? Should no limits apply? .....but then what do know, I live in a country where even the police aren't armed...... The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

For me Location. Talking to the various AFF students who come to the DZ, its mainly word-of-mouth, i.e. they get refered by skydivers. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Yes, we understand your point - you keep making precisely the same one over and over - if something happens, then someone might react in an over the top manner, and this might affect you. Frankly if we extend this philosophy logically, then we wouldn't skydive, we wouldn't drive cars (public transport is statistically safer), after all we wouldn't want to risk the government regulating. I rather that children could skydive, than they had access to guns, but then I guess that I have a topsy-turby view of the world. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

In New Zealand, parents/guardians can and do signs waivers for under 18-yr olds. I won't have let my six year skydive, but don't have any problem with the idea. Some say children get no benefit from this type of activity, but I wonder? Sure they may not appreciate the risks but activities like skiing, skydiving, mountain climbing, motorbiking can all contribute in a positive way towards the development of a well rounded and confident adult. Doing something different to the rest of the crowd can help in building self-esteem. Isn't that part of the of the attraction of skydiving, and doesn't it apply to adults and children? The following isn't skydiving, but involves more risk (and reward) than watching TV. http://www.stuff.co.nz/nelsonmail/4040299a6007.html Four-year-old Archer Irving seemed unperturbed as she hung hundreds of metres above Richmond, seemingly unaware that she was likely to be soaring her way into the record books. But it was another story for self-confessed overprotective mother Beck Irving of Nelson, who watched her daughter shoot high above the Barnicoat Range this month to become what is believed to be New Zealand's youngest hang-glider passenger. "It wasn't until that point I thought, `oh God' - the nervous mother kicked in." Archer's fascination with the sport began when she started noticing hang-gliders above the Barnicoat Range over a year ago. At Christmas, when they went up to watch some take-offs, the pestering began. "Like most mothers, I respond well to pestering." Ms Irving trusted the pilot "100 percent" but she was concerned that Archer might change her mind about the flight, once airborne. For Archer, the only mishap was shown on a DVD of the flight. As they neared the ground her nose started running and she was caught looking for somewhere to wipe her hand. Apart from that minor technicality, she remembered seeing Stoke, Richmond, a park, swings and cows during the 12?-minute flight that soared close to 1000m. "I felt like I was a bird," she told her mother after the flight. "I wasn't scared, Mum. Now it's your turn." Nelson Hang Gliding Adventures instructor Glenn Meadows, who took Archer up on the tandem flight, believed she was the youngest New Zealander to try the sport. He knew of some Queenstown hang-gliders who had taken 4?-year-olds up but Archer was younger still, he said. Mr Meadows, a veteran of more than 1000 flights, described her as "the most relaxed passenger I have ever had". "She was totally letting go and waving her arms around." Inspired by Archer's flight, another parent had asked Mr Meadows to take her four-year-old daughter up, but she was too small for the harness, he said. New Zealand Hang Gliding and Paragliding Association administrator Barbara Rooke said she wasn't aware of anyone younger than Archer hang-gliding in New Zealand. Civil Aviation Authority spokesman Bill Summer said age rules only applied to pilots and there were no limits about what age hang-gliding passengers had to be, as long as they were securely harnessed. "There doesn't seem to be a problem here." The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

When comparing or thinking about different activities safety, I prefer to think about a whole day's activity. For me for skydiving that's 4 or 5 jumps, riding a motorbike is 4-6 hours in the saddle, driving the car is 400-600km. Looking at the various accident rates and the resulting injuries, I'm certain that driving the car is the safest of these three, i.e. less risk of injury or death, and its a toss-up between riding the motorbike and skydiving for the most hazardous. The statement that 'skydiving is safer than driving' is IMHO, frankly nonsensical. Ask your life insurance company whether they are more concerned that you drive or skydive? As a skydiver I have looked at the risks and accept them as an integral part of something I love doing. Failure to fully appreciate the risks and hazards is the first step towards becoming a statistic. Be careful out there.... The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Depends how important not drowning is to you. Point taken, but how many skydivers can't swim? Water training can only help so much: having skills, the right equipment and confidence (staying relaxed, calm and avoiding panic - where have I heard that before?) in the water will greatly enhance your chances of survival. If you skydive somewhere where a water landing is possible/likely and you can't swim, get yourself down to the local pool and learn how. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

And you do understand the science behind it? Please explain? Just because its in the media and some people are willing to look at doesn't make it true. People have been talking about water powered cars for over thirty years (suppressed by the oil industry you know...). I have some prime real estate and the odd 20 million dollars I could give you if only you'll pay a small handling fee.... The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Anything you don't already know!!! - What it costs? How they structure training? When can you do it? Have they any info you can look at (websites are a good start)? How many AFF students do they train each year? How many at present? What sort of gear do they use? How old is it? How many instructors are there on staff? The questions aren't as important as the answers and the way they are delivered. Basically you are trying to get a feel for whether or not you will like the place and how effective and safe their training is going to be. I would suggest that a tandem skydive is probably a good way to get an introduction to the DZ. As a minimum go there one day and just watch what's happening - how friendly, professional and approachable are staff? What's the vibe like? Best plan is just to go out and do it. Blue skies and good luck with AFF. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

A few weeks the pilot had a dream that I bounced and he was good enough to tell me about it just as I was gearing up.... Needless to say but I'm still here The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Greetings - the rest of your post is pretty much right on the money, but this paragraph is wrong... The low voltage lines in your street typically carry 110-240 volts and generally only have fuses for protection - this means that anything hung up in them has to carry enough current for long enough to blow the fuse. the high voltage lines 6600, 11000, 22000 volts etc have earth fault protection which will operate for small animals etc, but usually requires 1-5 seconds of fault and will turn said animal in a burning mess of carbon. The human body (young and fit) can survive 50mA of current for 50ms. 110 volts is more than capable of supplying this and hence touching the live supply especially if you are earthed (touching something metal e.g. tap) at the same time is not a good idea and has killed many many people. The hazard from powerlines to skydivers is twofold. Firstly if you fly into them at speed you will probably hit the ground at a faster speed. They are hard to see and even a minor hit could cause a loss of control. Secondly if you get caught in them you can get a shock by touching one wire and another wire. You can also get a shock by touching one wire and the ground, or a grounded object such as a roof or concrete/metal power pole/python. Depending on the voltage and capacity of the lines, burning is as dangerous as shock and if you push the wires together on a high voltage line you can release energy similar to the amount it requires to make a plane take off. See Lutz video for actual demo. Back to the OP, it is hard to see any damage to the AAD in any circumstances where it would be of concern to the skydiver jumping it, put another way, if you are dead, badly broken or burnt, the function of your AAD will be low on your list of priorities. Stay safe people. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

My gun is a 270 The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Also makes it possible to read your alti while tracking The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

You've got a better chance of spotting them when you turn to start your track than from the aircraft. So are you saying that there's little point in spotting from the aircraft, best to leave it until you start your track? Seems to me that its probably easier to avoid canopies, small aircraft etc by staying in the plane for a few more seconds, that waiting until you are closing on them at 120 mph? The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

What about spotting? Did you or someone talk to the spotter? The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

True, but having a light grey canopy and jumpsuit makes you harder to see even if they are looking. I jump with someone with just such a canopy, and often find them difficult to find, even when I know where they should be! Of the other hand I have been told that my canopy is visible to skydivers in freefall. This is good luck, not good management as I bought it secondhand. My next canopy will have a similar combination of bright colours and dark colours to halp ensure it stands out as much as possible. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Is the ZP on Pilots harder to pack than other new canopies?? I test jumped a Pilot about a year ago. Loved flying the Pilot, but couldn't pack it at all. The only person who could easily manage it was the rigger at the DZ. Everyone else (including people with >5000 packjobs) struggled. In the end didn't buy it mainly because I didn't like the fit of the rig (it was second-hand and a little too small for me), but the thought of having to pack it was undoubtely part of the decision. Bought a safire II, and have never had a problem bagging it. The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Not sure but, see story .... ------------------------------------------------- A Taupo man who survived a 300-metre plummet to earth when his parachute did not open is on his feet - and ready to return to skydiving. The sky appears to be the limit for news media interest in Michael Holmes' story - with hefty cash offers flooding in for video footage from two cameras of his horrific freefall. Mr Holmes, 25, made headlines worldwide when his main parachute did not open in a routine skydive above Lake Taupo on December 13. The reserve chute also failed when it became entangled as the Taupo Tandem Skydive cameraman fell toward the ground, which took 30 seconds. As he fell at a rate of 160kmh, he is reported to have screamed, "Shit, I'm going to die." Mr Holmes, a 7000-jump veteran from the British Channel Island of Jersey, landed in thick blackberry bushes, which cushioned the impact, near the Lake Taupo shoreline at Five Mile Bay. He confirmed to The Dominion Post that he was still recovering from injuries that knocked him unconscious, including a punctured lung and a badly broken ankle. He has had two operations. Discharged from Waikato Hospital in the New Year, he is back in Taupo, walking on crutches. His fall was captured by two cameras - his own helmet camera and another skydiver's. His camera footage shows his shadow with the ground rapidly approaching. He is holding some rope in his hands and he can be heard screaming. The films have been seen by Taupo's skydiving fraternity in a private showing. Mr Holmes' employers, Taupo Tandem Skydiving, have allowed him to sell the footage to the highest bidder. He has fielded news media inquiries from around the world and has hired a celebrity public relations adviser, Max Markson, to broker his exclusive story. "It was a normal jump until I tried to release my chute at 4000 feet," Mr Holmes reportedly told British tabloid The Sun. "It didn't open and didn't cut away. I thought my life was over. You do not have much time to say goodbye." "There's been quite a bit of interest in the film but I can't really say too much at the moment," he told The Dominion Post. It is understood he was initially offered £15,000 ($NZ43,000) by a British media outlet. The Discovery Channel is also understood to be interested and there are reports Mr Holmes has been asked to appear on the Jay Leno Late Show in the United States. He met Mr Markson in Taupo earlier this month. The PR guru was keeping negotiations close to his chest. Mr Markson said he was "brokering a few deals" and had an "arrangement with Australian and New Zealand media". "I would love to discuss it with you but I am bound by strict confidentiality. It's not possible yet to say anything. It is an amazing story. It's wonderful he is alive." New Zealand Parachute Industry Association safety officer Keith Gallaher viewed the fall footage to prepare a report on the accident. He he hoped to talk to Mr Holmes soon before signing the report off. The report would be sent to Civil Aviation Authority to investigate the accident. He did not know if the report would be made public. "That will be CAA's decision." Mr Holmes' father, Michael Holmes senior, did not expect his son to be grounded for a long time. "Michael is Michael. He will bounce back from it and he will be skydiving again." The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Is there a risk of getting your hands caught in the risers if you grab the risers to push them apart while spinning? On the few occasions I have been faced with a few line twists, I push the risers apart and kick just as you described, but wonder if this might get you into trouble with a high speed spin? The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

In your experience, how easy or difficult is it to spot other aircraft? How much time do you spend looking before you are happy the air space is clear of traffic? I ask as I jump at an 'uncrowded' dropzone with few other aircraft and so am never sure if looking and seeing nothing means its clear or that I'm going blind?? The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Agreed. Like South Africa, the number of skydivers in NZ is small. This means that there isn't alot of choice in secondhand equipment or you have to buy sight unseen (not even by a rigger you or a friend knows/trusts). It also means that it isn't easy to onsell the euipment when you want to upgrade. As a result new skydivers, more often than their counterparts in the USA, purchase new equipment or equipment than is less than ideal and know that they will have to jump it for a long time. This tends to result in higher wing loadings at lower jump numbers than those recommended here on DZ.com or just poor fitting/functioning equipment. On the plus side, a lower of jumpers means that literally everybody knows everybody and the reputation of 'unsafe' jumpers spreads quickly. Out of interest, NZ has a national accident insurance scheme (called ACC). Recent analysis of the costs of accidents: http://www.stuff.co.nz/3900085a6009.html "High-injury risk" adventure sports, topped in frequency by mountainbiking, horse-riding, tramping and surfing, cost the country over $12m in 2004-05, according to research published in today's New Zealand Medical Journal. The safest of 28 activities considered were bungy jumping, skydiving and skiing, which lead researcher Tim Bentley attributed to tight regulation within those activities." Is there any comparsion of the accident rate in USA versus Western Europe (where economic/population numbers are comparable)? The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

Don't forget the South Island. Some of the most beautiful scenery anywhere. Jump at Motueka for views over Nelson/Abel Tasman National Park and Fox Glacier for Pacific Ocean on one side and 12000' Mountains and glaciers on the other. Blue Skies The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein