tkhayes

Yes we do. And when it fails, as it did and has, we have people like Bradley Manning to correct it. And we have people like me that support those types of maneuvers by insiders when they see wrong happening and no one is doing anything about it. Accountability and transparency is not just a concept - it takes action and human intervention at all levels to make it work. i.e. I don't see BP employees sitting in solitary confinement for months because they ratted out the insider info on their company, even though it was the largest environmental disaster in the history of the USA and the Gulf. yeah yeah I know I know, it's DIFFERENT! Well it's not really. A BP insider is hailed as a hero because they spoke up and exposed the wrong-doing. Manning is prosecuted because he spoke up about the wrong-doing. clear as day.

there is no more need for detail - NO SECRETS. If we were not in Iraq in the first place, there would be no Iraqi war logs to keep secret. There would be no government agencies paid to keep the secrets. There would be no need for the secrets. Or the government agencies paid to keep them. think of the savings. no wars and no secret keepers. wow, we could actually spend the money on roads and education instead. maybe even health care. i made myself very clear in other threads in other posts as to what I think about government secrecy. It's a bad thing. especially if you believe in government transparency and government accountability. Now if you believe in moving closer and closer to a police state, as many of you seem to, then it is a great thing.

umm, I don't know, maybe I'm just a citizen that wants government accountability and transparency and NOT some group of blind-faith, purple-koolaid-drinking drones letting them do whatever they want whenever they want....? Including the military. duh?

people might be leaving in droves, but sadly, not nearly enough to affect the outcome, which will be either a Dem or Rep government. The country desperately needs a third and/or fourth alternative. Too many people voting for one or the other 'because they don't want to other guy to win' instead of voting for what they really believe in, which undermines democracy at its very base. And the entire system is rigged anyway for the two-party system. Also corrupt and also needs to be fundamentally dismantled. Starting with removing ANY affiliation with ANY party on voter registrations. If parties want to recruit, they can do it on their own.

this is not 'damage' nor does the link you posted describe any. so I'm still waiting.....

Calendar is regularly being updated with events and fun things. Stuff to do every evening, and we have helicopter arriving Thurs/Fri http://www.skydivecity.com

No he's not - and that's an ridiculous exaggeration. Govt (driven by public opinion) is simply trying to make it cleaner, which is not a bad thing. There are hundreds of years of coal reserves left, and only a hundred or so years of oil. Someday yes it will all be gone, but i am not under any delusion that somehow we can do without oil and/or coal. again a ridiculous to-the-extreme exaggeration of what is really going on. There are trillions of dollars in reasons as to why the country has a deficit, and it is not because of the Chevy Volt. The arguments about taxation and defictis, wars and wasteful govt spending have alreayd been made in dozens of other threads for and against, maybe you should re-read those, as i am not interested in arguing it here. Bottom line. Coal generated electricity to push electric cars around the country is MANY TIMES more efficient use of energy than burning gasoline in cars in tiny cylinders. Investing in it is wise for the country. It makes maximum use of coal which we have lots of, and extends our supply of oil out perhaps another hundred years. We will burn more coal and we will burn FAR LESS oil

If you are intolerant of intolerance, does that make you a hypocrite?

so we let the military run rampant, even if it is wrong and even if the soldiers know that it is wrong. We take and only 'take' orders. No one questions anything, ever. Why people don't understand why this is a problem is beyond me.

spoken like a true right-wing Christian filled with intolerance.

that picture is fucking awesome....

Actually the whole point of the thread was that he did NO damage. And here we go again - he's a traitor, he let out secrets, he's a treasonist, people got harmed, whatever. So far NO ONE, not anyone, has put forth once ounce of harm done by Bradley Manning So I would dispute that, NO HARM has been done whatsoever. In fact, the only people that think harm has been done are the ones we pay to keep all those 'secrets. Think of the government waste in real dollars. We pay entire agencies, probably tens of thousands of employees in the government to keep secrets that do not need to be kept (apparently). Everyone talks about government waste, but everyone seemingly supports our slide into a secret police state in favor of 'security'. If we sacked all those 'secret keepers', I expect the sun would still rise tomorrow morning. Exposing murder by the military? Exposing torture endorsed by our leaders? He should get a Congressional Medal of Honor, not 19 months in detention without a hearing.

I bet he still gets life, sad but true. Fear is the greatest motivator up and down the line and with the political climate against wikileaks, there is no way they can acquit Manning or see him with a lighter sentence and still make a case against Julian Assange. I thought we were dealing with massive unemployment, economic disaster, food, jobs, the environment, oil supplies future of education etc... yet we continue to waste our time and money on crap like this. i wonder what the Bradley Manning case has cost the taxpayer since it was uncovered. Publish THAT figure and see what kind of a response you get from the American people.

agreed, the new gas/diesel engines are far better than the old ones, but comparing the efficiency to electric at any level is apples and oranges. The real saving sis how we generate the power. As I said, generating electricity with coal and distributing it en masse is way more efficient and fuel saving that generating horsepower by burning fossil fuels in little cylinders. No different that it being way more efficient to carry 100 people in a bus than it is to carry 100 people in 50 cars. Same technology, you can still burn fossil fuels, you just burn a whole lot less of it.

All motors run best and most efficient at a constant speed and torque etc But electric motors at any speed are still way way way more efficient than any ICE counterPart Almost all the energy used goes directly to torque from zero rpm onward

And generating power en masse, even with fossil fuels, is far more efficient than say, burning fossil fuels in individual car engines that run an efficiency of some 30% usage of the energy that is generated. Most of it is lost to heat or spit out the tailpipe. Electric motors have efficiencies of some 95-99%, meaning the energy used becomes torque directly. Generating that energy, even if all we burned was dirty coal, is far more efficient that the millions of gasoline engines that are out there. I guess you missed the electrical engineering class - I did not.

Touched a nerve did we? I rest my case

Just one example of hundreds if not thousands of actions taken every day by Christians in this country. Indoctrination at its worst. Christians everywhere are teaching Americans to hate. get used to it. Religion is bad at all levels. Don't blame the Muslims for teaching hate when Christians do it every day.

And if you think we can rely on fossil fuels forever, *OR* just wait until they run out before we try something else, then i guess you are delusional.

But those happened over hundreds if not thousands of years. We are changing the climate over a period of less than 100 years, which is abnormal except perhaps for an asteroid strike. Direct causation? No there is not. But there is plenty of evidence outside of the correlation. There's plenty of causation & correlation arguments to say that evolution did not happen either, but the evidence is to the contrary. When 95+% of the scientists in the world agree on something, i tend to listen to them. At least when they are found to be be slightly off course, they tend to adjust the correlations and/or causation theories and arguments. The non-believers simply have no evidence to support their claim except for the simple 'denial' of the causation. At any given moment in time there is a fixed amount of 'air' on the planet. And we can fairly accurately measure the amount of garbage that we are pumping into that 'air' at almost any moment in time as well. It ain't rocket science to come to a conclusion that damage is being done. Direct causation? No. Plenty of really good evidence? Absolutely.

There may very well have been WMDs at some point, Iraq and Iran fought a war for years. However to say that it was a valid reason for an invasion is bunk. Because there were NONE, nada, zip, ziltch, zero. There are books out there with good reasons to suggest that 9/11 was a government plot and that the sky is filled with green spaghetti monsters too.

Winsor, that is a brilliant piece of writing - thanks. Could not have said it better myself. +1

no not anyone - Perry and or Bachmann would be a complete disaster. Newt and/or Romney would be business as usual - nothing would change.

sure - he can take the credit for it - I have no problem with that. However I do have a problem with the lack of war crimes prosecution for starting it in the first place. My Uncle Fred groped a young girl - does it make it right if he buys her a lollipop afterwards?

you missed my poitn as usual, so I will state is again: Bush was so fucking wrong with all aspects of this war, I cannot believe he could take any credit except for taking the credit for starting it. And if he takes the credit for starting it then he should also be taking the blame for starting it.