tkhayes

my reply was: "It's about the people, not the one." you focus on one, consistently, all the time one example out of millions and yet the article says nothing about who what when where how or why, and given the source, it must be TOTALLY credible.... again, large numbers of people making a difference. MLK women's suffrage, Civil war slavery Libya should I go on? well should I? go ahead, find another tidbit about MLK go ahead, make my day if that is all you have.....

hey mneal whatever - your post got deleted so fast i could not respond to it in time.... wonder why?

you're right, large numbers of people wanting change has never worked in the past.... what was i thinking....? MLK Women's Sufferage slavery Civil War Libya need i go on.... well need I?

yea, well if you ask our Gov Rick Scott, he would say "What we you thinking? Becoming a molecular Biologist?" http://weblogs.sun-sentinel.com/educationblog/2011/10/rick_scott_says_no_to_anthropo.html Sadly, everyone has a place in society (I think) and yet so many are focused on only one thing - how much money it makes. Humanity is about humans. Last time I checked the Constitution and the country was about people "We the People...." Yet so many on the right wing cannot conceive that even 'normal' working people with iphones and macs CAN actually be pissed off at the system. Am I supposed to be grateful or something if I see injustice? It's kind like like women should be thankful that they ONLY take away abortion rights and thank god they got the vote..... ridiculous. There are a lot of people in this country that are pissed off and there are a lot of people in this country that want change. And they are not all liberals....

I am actually going to one of the local events tomorrow- EXPLOSION!!!!

you have no idea how many of these people have iPhones, macs or whatever. Name someone today that DOES NOT have a cell phone. You have no idea how many of these people eat caviar either. Much like lawrocket - you are simply stereotyping. And yes, there is a problem, otherwise the movement would not have actually spread to the hundred or so cities already. Just because you are incapable of seeing the issue does not mean there is not one. And if everyone started "Apple" in their garage, there would be no one to buy their products except themselves. Your assumption is that all of them are not trying. I expect if you took the time to go to one of these events and ask 5 people their story, they would be more than happy to give it to you. And I expect that you would rather stay at home and be an internet-critic.

unemployed people can.

saving hundreds of dollars when no one else can apparently match that price should also set alarm bells off for most people. I get emails every day where I can buy complete Adobe suites worth $1500 for as little as $99 if I would only give them my credit card...... You are just one of the lucky ones - you got your gear before the pyramid collapsed.

all that demonstrates is that a lot of wealthy and better-off people are actually in support of the Occupy movement. Warren Buffet for one. And yes there are thousands of others. This surprises anyone?

It's the oldest and the lamest argument of them all, yet it gets used every day. CARS don't kill people either. But we restrict them and we license them, and companies get sued over them, and laws are made to make them better and manufacturers are forced through civil courts and recalls to improve them, and we decide who can drive them and who cannot. So the CAR did not kill anyone, but it is still the target of "How do we fix this?" and rightly so. But the gun is protected in the constitution so it is 'out of bounds' And I said earlier, and many times before, very sarcastically, "The USA does not have a gun problem" yeah right!

Schizophrenia is 'not' badshit crazy as you might put it. and who gets to decide? you? me? Yet another government agency? My point was that everyone screams there is no 'gun problem' in the USA. I made my point.

It's his constitutional right to own all the guns he wants afterall. As a matter of fact, society is to blame because surely if there is a mentally ill person who owns guns, then everyone around that person should be obligated to own even MORE guns to protect themselves from any fallout. No, there is no gun problem....

OK I agree with some of that. Why would anyone go to a private liberal arts program for $40-50K per year when community/state colleges are available at far lower prices.? Somewhere along the line, they must be thinking that they are getting a better education which = better pay, or they are already stinking rich, whatever. Even wealthy Americans take out student loans, most of the time because the terms of the loans are (sometimes) better than the returns they get on their money I do not disagree with the arguments. The best way to lower those tuition prices? Stop going to the colleges that charge too much. BUT, I still do not have an answer for ANY example of someone being $200K in debt with a $30K job. The only person i have ever met that has a $200K college debt is an ER doctor who will be able to pay it off. Yes it hurts, but they will be able to pay it off. And they are making far more than $30K. job markets are bad for everyone, hence the social uprising we see around the country. tea-party or not. right wing or not, economics or not, if this country does not start taking care of its PEOPLE, instead of corporations, then we will likely (eventually) see a French Revolution event. easing student debt is one way to do that.

I am not doubting your numbers, but there is a huge difference between $200k debt (alleged by the original post) and a $30K job and $90K debt and a $28K job. just sayin' can you pay off $90K? yes you can. People buy houses and cars and they pay them off too. I have no idea what the interest rates are or the typically term as I went to 3 years of college, but never had a student loan. But my tuition was nothing like it is today either. All the more reason for subsidized education. Educate your people and in one generation, you will solve many of the problems you have in any society. too bad politicians typically only look as far as the next 4 years.

it's as scary as fuck. I did two jumps into the homecoming game in Miami's Orange Bowl - I almost shit myself..... would I do it again? Hell yeah....

and I didn't say that you said.....whatever. My original response was to the originator of the thread. You responded instead. Your examples cite 'estimations' on your part. I am not asking for your friend's social security number but something along the line of "my brother has $200K in debt and has a $30K job" would still be marginally more accurate that what you replied with. not "ever heard of a NE school?" whatever. The original poster started a thread stating a 'problem' that needed to be fixed apparently. I countered with an arguement that perhaps this is not a 'problem at all' by asking for some specific examples. It's kind of like saying we need to scrap welfare because there are 0.01% slackers on the welfare roles. I am sure there are people out there with piss-poor jobs and high student debt. I doubt that is the norm. That is my point. And the examples that you and phreezone cite imply that EVERY NICKEL someone spent going to school was taken out in the form of a student loan, I also doubt that this is the 'norm'. So unless you can show me a REAL EXAMPLE of someone who has $200K in debt and only has a $30K job, then my argument will stand that this is nothing more than a 'reach' to stereotype all students into some category that does not actually exist.

Again I will ask for a REAL example not your extrapolation of what you think your friend might be paying. I am pretty sure that the majority of students are no where near what you are trying to describe as some sort of 'norm'

who has $200k in student debt that only got them a $30K job? example please.

All I am saying is that everyone jumps on PETA because they are radical. Maybe this time they have a case. orcas live in the wild and travel tens of thousands of miles every year. Now they are in a tank that is probably 0.000001% the size of a suitable environment. If PETA wants a lawsuit, I guess they can have one. And yes, being people, we DO ACTUALLY speak for the animals, whether that is right or wrong. The orca show is cute, but it is a bit of a freak show. That bothers me. But the environment is degrading so rapidly out there that maybe human captivity is the only way to preserve some species from extinction. That may be. But then I am more inclined that we fund the 'preservation of the species' rather than the 'entertainment for kids'

PETA might be a radical group, but unless you can see the plight from the point of the orcas, then you have no say in the matter. Who says they are happy and/or well cared for? If they are now, then were they 30 years ago? We look back and find all the problems that used to plague captive animals and then we assume we are doing it Ok now. We judge by todays standards. yet in another 30 years we will look back at the way we treat captive animals today and go "What were we thinking?" walk a mile in a man's (orca's) shoes.....

I grew up in Christian home, Anglican Church in Gander, Newfoundland. My parents and grandparents were very religious. I went to church every Sunday and Sunday school as early back as I can remember. We even had 'religion classes' in public school. all Christian of course, what a no-no today. I remember even in Sunday School wondering about these stories we were told, I was maybe 5-6 years old and thinking "great story but REALLY?" several years of church camp, confirmation, even did the readings of the scripture, Psalms, etc for years. But when I was 14 years old, sitting in church Sunday morning, watching 'Uncle' Jimmy Warren (one of our school teachers) singing the hymn at the top of his lungs (which he always did) along with everyone else (pretty packed house every Sunday) I had my epiphany. This is all bullshit. Actually I wanted to stand up on the pew and scream "What the fuck are you all doing? Get ahold of yourselves!" But I didn't. I kept my mouth shut because that is what you did in this town/family/culture/whatever. Not even sure that I knew what an atheist was then or that they existed. I continued with church activities, reading every Sunday and the minister Rev Reid started a teen 'Bible study' youth group that met every Sunday morning for an hour before regular service in the basement of the rectory (which he used as a project room for his hobbies.) I went to those classes with 6-7 others until i finished high school and went to college. That was actually kind of fun. We never really studied the Bible. we talked about teenage problems, drugs, alcohol, getting in trouble with the law, setting life goals, whaddya wanna be when you grow up, etc. Rev Reid was an electronics geek like me so we always had time to talk about the Heathkit TV he was building or the amplifier/whatever that I was building. He was really a good guy. But then at the end, in the last two minutes, he would always try to tie whatever we were talking about into some 'lesson from God or the Bible' sort of thing - and I would think "Really? I mean c'mon, you're smarter than that...." Then we'd wrap it up and walk across to the church where again, I would be one of the folks reading the 'lesson' that Sunday. After college, I am not sure I ever went to church again. I was out of the house, so no need to. Right about that time, the Catholic church had it's first scandal outed right in our back yard (Newfoundland) molesting children and that pretty much cemented it for me that religion was a bunch of hypocritical bullshit. Almost 40 years later the CC is still denying 'they knew anything' even as recent as the 2010 exposing in Philadelphia. My Mom and Stepfather still go to church almost every Sunday, (also different denominations), and my aunt and uncle are rabid Anglicans, almost fundamentalist evangelical, if that is possible within the Anglican church, the most BORING church in all of history (which was founded on divorce and adultery - Eddie Izzard joke). I used to be quiet about it. When I was younger it did not really affect me. I ignore it and I poke fun at it. As I get older, as most folks seem to do - I get more involved politically and with a lifetime of experience behind me, I now see the damage it does and the evil that exists within it all and the crazy directions that it seems to take people in despite ALL COMMON SENSE. so now it just pisses me off that people cannot think for themselves and that mankind sells itself short by 'turning to god' to solve problems (Rick Perry). My poor mom still thinks I might burn in hell, but I am not sure she even really believes it. I think it is just a belief structure that she has been exposed to her whole life and it is too complex a thought for her to abandon it now. "I suppose you haven't been to church for years?" she will say now and then. "No Mom, I haven't been to church...." Occasionally she will make some comment like "Look at your dogs and how smart they are...how can you possibly think that they did not come from a god/creator/whatever?" "Is that the same god that also invented e-coli bacteria Mom?" Oddly enough, I even got an Anglican minister for my first wedding. He canceled last minute and I had to find a United Church minister to do it. Part of the reason was Justice of the Peace in Canada was pretty rare and hard to find and expensive. Harder to find a minister willing to do a wedding outside the church (we got married in a park). But the fact that i even got a minister at all always bothered me. We sterilized the service to pretty 'bland' as far as the religion references,but I always think how ironic that was for me to do. Second wedding was in a friend's back yard in Florida with a friend doing the service who had the legal whatever to do it. I still have people in my life who say something like "Well you'll come around and come back someday" like it's some sort of fucking disease. I wonder what they would say if I said that same thing to them? That's it. I think I was always a non-believer, I just did not know what it/that was. I gave it a good effort when I was younger. I actually used to think there was something wrong with me because I "didn't get it". Now in later years, I realize that a lot of the kids around me at the time also "didn't get it" - no one dared to speak up. I am really glad for the opening up of society to the acceptance of atheism, homosexuality, drug/alcohol abuse - pretty much anything that people keep in the closet. No one ever dared to talk about these things and society and people suffered because of it. Nowadays, I cannot think that just plain old honesty would go a long way to helping solve our problems, at least heading in that direction. Religion just serves to suppress and oppress. So much for 'freedom'.

First time I saw any of this stuff - I am in fucking tears.....

I have no idea why you would NOT want to see what you just bought. tear it down, check everything over, repack it and jump.

legal recourse. every state has the ability to collect on unpaid debts. Go to the courthouse and ask about it.

Staff does so many jumps they get bored and have to find ways to entertain themselves. The jokes get used a lot and they get old, but the joke is not for the pleasure of the student, the joke is for the pleasure of the staff. People (in many industries) tend to forget.... it's not actually about them. It's about the customer. It's about the customer. It's about the customer. It's about the customer. But if no one is at the top reminding them of that every day, then it (can) grows more and more outrageous.