tkhayes

GWB is not going to Switzerland any time soon for the exact same reasons; he might actually get arrested. If I had charges pending in any country, I would expect that I would pull any and every legal move to not get shipped there, - it's not 'above the law', it's using the law and your rights to your benefit. Given the USA record of torture, indefinite detention and other violations of human rights around the world [sarcaastic]in our interest of security of course[/sarcastic], I expect that Assange should fucking well be concerned.

What's next is that over time, the ACA probably fails due to corruption in the system. Corporations instead of lowering rates, raise them, and they make out like bandits with little or no improvement in actual health care delivery. Then we change it to single payer to resolve the corporate corruption and leave people who want to do private insurance free to do it, and they will still pay taxes to fund the public system, just like education. just my guess.

so to make a demo jump NOT a demo jump, you just simply have to say "It's not a demo jump" ?

If they ask about you and you lie, then they likely can and will cancel the policy. If they do not ask you about it, and the policy does not specifically exclude that, then it is unlikely that they would not pay out. Shop around, I got mine through prudential and it covers skydiving.

Not much - but the point is that you already DO NOT vote in my district. There is not a problem with voting in my district by guys named DaVinci. So to pass a law to further cause you to NOT vote in my district seems moot. Once again, there is NO DEMONSTRATED PROBLEM with illegal voting that is worth pursuing. fuck, we can barely get the legal population to vote, why is everyone so concerned about the statistically insignificant portion that MIGHT be illegal? But if you DO vote in my district and you do it illegally, then Gov. Scott can do his investigation into illegal voters, just like he is doing now. But instead of canceling the right to vote for many, he could investigate (with the arm of law behind him), and then prosecute you for the crime that you committed. That is how it works. But right now, no one has found a bunch of illegal voters - they have only found a few. prosecute them - and maybe it will be a deterrent to others who think about it.

I do not think I ever touted or claimed that their would be widespread destruction fo voters rights. What I said is we are creating a problem bigger than the one than we are fixing. Glad the system worked for you - what about the people that moved and never got the notice or the card in the mail? How big is the voter fraud problem in TN? Has it even been defined? How many people who are valid to vote will end up not being able to vote in Nov due to the new system? That's data and that will determine whether or not it was worthwhile. I'll look forward to your updates on TN since we do not see nay news of it here in FL

Robin William's from Moscow on the Hudson: When I was in Russia, I did not love my life... ...but I loved my misery. You know why? Because it was my misery. I could hold it. I could caress it. I loved my misery. My ex-wife's family - Chinese cultural issues - yes, they were indeed miserable most of the time. I think it mostly boils down to brain chemistry influenced by social surroundings. Being miserable, being happy - you can be either. Just like being a welder or being an engineer - you can be either. People cut themselves with razor blades - I have no idea why - they just do. Cannot possibly feel "good" - or does it?

all that ranting would be fine if that is all that it is/was. But it is not. What is ACTUALLY is, is Governors like Rick Scott, who then take an interpretation of a Voter ID law to purge 180000+ people off the roles and dump the responsibility back on them to fix it in 30 days or they may not get to vote, and they may not find out until election day that they were purged. And people think Bradley Manning is guilty of treason? I'll vote for your interpretation of the voter ID process if ANY OTHER ATTEMPT to stop voters from voting is met with federal criminal charges, which would at least be defending the Constitution, instead of openly allowing government to limit it. We already have a judicial branch of the government. If there are people breaking the law by voting illegally, then go investigate/prosecute it. But using the executive power of the administrative branch to dump citizens, should be considered illegal as well. Instead, the feds simply sue. How about arresting him?

ditto

probably true. I hope that the 'excluded citizens' sue the government for violation of their civil rights and get hundreds of millions of dollars - and that the burden of that gets passed onto the taxpayer, who then decides for themselves that it really was not all worth the effort. But Americans are pretty apathetic. It seems that it is OK to kill innocent people on the street, it is OK to exclude citizens from voting, it is OK to torture and hold people without trial, and it is OK to let all that go on time and time again.....

In this century? Or the last one? I am also far more recently on record as saying I gave up on the gun debate. I am all for issuing guns to children when they start kindergarten and making it mandatory that everyone carries a loaded handgun at all times. The more the merrier, and the sooner that all the gun nuts will start killing each other off. THen we might get some common sense laws about it. The majority of people do not think that, nor have they ever. Hence it is a lie. No one thinks that the 'wars' are free. You assume far too much ignorance from your own people, as ignorant as they may be. re-read my recent posts. I am not. I also object to the registration process, which then, allows people to set up rules that can EXCLUDE groups of people from voting. wrong. I believe that ANY citizen has the right to vote. The record of citizens should be maintained by the government, if needed at all, and the burden of proof should not be on the citizen. Felons, drug dealers, child molesters, I do not care who can vote, if they are citizens, they get to vote. It is far less overhead to maintain an open election than it is to try and maintain a record of who CANNOT vote, and that fact has been demonstrated, especially here in Florida, over and over again. They continue to get it wrong. Everyone gets to vote, let the chips fall where they may. Give me valid reason, other than citizenship, that a person should not be allowed to vote in this country.

glad that we agree that voter ID requirements as written are a bad idea. thanks

no funnier than you 'unrating' it -

in your opinion. I notice you did not comment on the rest of my rathe rlong and articulate post, so perhaps then, the rest of it is not actually bullshit, but quite factual.

funny how people are seemingly Ok with a few innocent people getting killed in the name of the right to carry guns, OR murderers getting away with murder, but no one is tolerate of a few illegal votes that make no difference in an election and would willingly restrict the rights of MANY citizens to stop a handful of those votes. Let's apply the Voter ID logic to the gun debate. I will take away all your guns to stop a handful of illegals from using them. How does that sound? What's wrong with this picture? Oh yes - some Americans are fucked in the head....that's what's wrong with this picture.....

I posted a link to an article in the Tampa Bay Times, relating many stories and instances of the use of SYG, demographics, mixed results and such. If you do nto have the time to read it, then too bad. I took the time to read it. If you want to claim that it is something other than what it is, then that is an issue between you and the author, not you and me. The article is far from 'vague' and it looks like the author did some pretty good investigative reporting. The conclusion? It's a poorly written law. http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/crime/article1233133.ece

I never made an opinion on the article other than 'a lot of people are dead' because of SYG The article shows justified cases, I pointed that out. The article shows unjustified cases. i pointed that out too. The article shows racial bias, but in fact, I did not point that out. The article shows murders getting off scott-free and people in similar cases getting jailed. The article shows inconsistencies in the application of the law. And I pointed all that out as a basis for a poorly written law. not my 'preconceived opinion' - it actually points out many sides of the argument, but most of all, it points out a poorly written piece of legislation. But if you are Ok with innocent people getting killed, and murderers getting away with it, then i guess that law will just have to do.....

Not just one example, an article that pointed out 157 examples. And if it was so clear cut, one of them would be in jail. but they are not.

That is a lie. that is a lie that is a lie, and I did not say that, so far you are batting 1000 for making shit up as you go along. Canada's voting system is far different that the USA, and certainly Florida's. Yes they require ID, no it does not disenfranchise CANADIAN voters, but that is NOT BECAUSE OF ID's. I expect more people in Canada have ID's, because it is a more heavily regulated country - which Americans despise. It's apples and oranges why Canadian voters vote versus why US voters vote. If I stood up and compared Canada to the USA as far as reasons for gun control - you people would eat me alive. How is it then that YOU get to exclusively compare Canada only when it suits your purposes? The systems are different. The voting is different. The political process is different and the reasons people go to the polls are different. In florida, we have people that live in swamps, work for cash, drive unlicensed vehicles with unlicensed drivers, live off the radar and do not have ID's. And they still have the right to vote because of this seemingly little-known document called the Constitution. And if you are going to make that guy go get a drivers license, which he is NOT required to have to be an American, or a passport, which he is NOT required to have as an American, or get some other form of government ID, which he is NOT required to have to be an American, then you ar in fact, depriving him of his civil rights when he goes to vote. And taking that further - if you are then going to PURGE the roles for fear that some swamp-living-ID-less-people 'might vote', a problem that has YET TO BE EVEN DEMONSTRATED AS A STATISTICALLY VALID PROBLEM, then you are now depriving many valid citizens of their right to vote. just like SYG, these are piss poor laws, piss-poorly written by idiots in government whose agenda, I ASSURE YOU, is not really trying to make sure non-citizens are not voting. Just like redistricting, campaigning, election rules, choosing procedures, everything is about making sure THEY get elected. Your faith in government amazes me. and I debate your WORDS and POSITIONS. ditto

the race-baiting did not actually happen to any extent that affected the end result in his being arrested. It is a right-wing para-sympathetic attempt at changing the subject. You are talking about a semi-latino and a black kid. The TBO.com article about SYG already showed dozens of similar shootings, and a lot of them were mixed color shootings - the race card did not get played there either, and the outcomes were mixed. Maybe the reason that people are upset is because a wannabe cop, marching around a neighborhood with a gun shooting kids armed with Skittles IS actually a menace to society and they would like something done about it. Sounds pretty fucking clear cut to me. He can still beat this if he decides for himself to play by the rules. If it is so race-related, then why do we not actually see all the race players involved with this anymore? They all went away. i expect that most people just wanted to see Z arrested, like I did, and they want him to be tried in front of a jury and let it take its course - but to walk away scott free for being a douchebag - no way.

Glad you admit that there is, in fact, a problem.

already being discussed in another thread

we're not talking about Canada, nor are we talking aboiut HC. I never said/suggested Canada was evil - you did I never said/suggested HC was free - you did Part of the problem between our discussions is your (incorrect) beliefs that I fit into some mold that you want me to fit into. ditto. If you want to talk about Voter ID, then let's do that. If you want to bash TK for being TK, then start another thread. i never said that either.....I said it is probably not worth wasting our time to fix a few hundred illegal ballots. Your 'PERFECT' system of voter ID being required will not fix the problem of a few still getting through unless you actually believe that no one out there has a fake ID. And it will in fact remove thousands from the voter rolls that are in fact eligible to vote. So we are trying to fix a problem that probably cannot be fixed. Maybe I don't know about the "very very big government" that the right-wing is trying to reduce, because policies like this actually require an expansion of government to implement. Even a lefty like me is not interested in this sort of big government, trying to fix imaginary problems, spending million to do it and all the time complaining about the government, when the government in this case is being driven by the people that are trying to get rid of the government. sheesh.

I did not pick it. The Tampa Tribune did. I just copied it. Along with the other Tampa article a few weeks ago about the couple hundred incidents that have fallen under SYG. the law is faulty, it is misapplied, it is misinterpreted. As a result, innocent people are dead, guilty people are walking free, and many many cases have different results for given the same circumstances. Well-written laws don't often have this sort of a problem. If you cannot write good laws, then don't write them at all.

In which direction are they misapplying it? If you ask the demographic, ask the State Senate, ask the judges and ask the prosecutors, I expect you will get a split on how they think it should be applied.