jacketsdb23

Jim - SPOT ON! Well said. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

My issue is with naming the aad manufacturer. obviously, the rigger bears some responsibility in not fulfilling the duties of his certification. To what end should he be punished? I don't know, but I bet there is nothing the courts could do to make that man feel worse than he already does. I still think that this is a risky sport. I disagree that we should accept that students will not execute ep's corrrectly. If they do it wrong, or fail to do it, how can it be anyone elses fault they get hurt or die? This assumes they've been trained correctly. Go ahead and take all the riggers assets...feel better? Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

I haven't heard anyone say that. I personally would love to see the day in which for any given year(s) our fatality rate is 0. The AAD is a great product. Adding gizmos and gadgets to it for the 1 in 100,000 (i don't know what the odds are) chance that a rigger doesn't route the closing loop through it is not the answer. I don't believe lawyers/courts should get involved when someone voluntarily throws their body out of an airplane towards the ground. A blanket lawsuit which is going after money, is a terrible thing for the sport. #1 fault lies with the skydiver...even if people outside of the sport do not agree. So do we sue others now, just because we can? Its wrong. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

The difference is subtle but important. A molar strap leaves a reserve useless. Doesn't matter what the jumper does after he deploys the reserve (or the AAD does it), its useless. A world class jumper is unlikely to go in without pulling the reserve handle himself. If he is knocked unconscious, the backup device, can potentially save him. If the rigger in question made the same mistake, same result except the skydiver was unable to pull for himself. At the end of the day we all roll the dice in some fashion and most of us accept and understand the risks. Even the risk that our reserve won't work because of a rigger mistake. In this case, the reserve was fine. The jumper was fine. All he had to do was pull. We need to get back to some sort of personal responsibility. Skydiving is not for everyone. (Not directed at you grimmie, i know you understand all this.) Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

There is inherent risk in skydiving. Risk, and associated injuries/fatalities usually involves a mistake by one or more parties. Human beings are not perfect, nor will they ever be. In this case, the first line of defense...the skydiver pulling his own reserve handle did not happen. The secondary backup device, worked, but unfortunately a human made an error to render that device useless. AAD's do a lot more good than harm in the skydiving industry. Lawsuits like this add unnecessary costs to the manufacturer and will end up costing jumpers more to purchase them. They are already at the top end of what most jumpers are willing to spend to use them. This lawsuit is not productive for skydivers. 1 out of tens of thousands of repacks, and saves in the 100's, and some lawyers wants to name a product in a lawsuit that worked. Unbelievable, and wrong on so many levels. The industry should sue those bringing up this suit because the skydiver failed his basic responsibility in getting a parachute over his head. The distress his failed action has placed on manufacturers and the DZO surely has as much merit as the suit in question. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

Tim, you had fun writing that. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

We had a beautiful day yesterday up at Skydive Sacramento for the NCCPA canopy piloting comp. #2. We had 12 competitors total with 3 competing on 10ft gates and 9 competing on the 5ft gates. The top four spots were tight all competition long and in the end, some guy named Jonathan Tagle took first. Norcal locals Ryan Brownlow and Pete Galli followed up with 2nd and 3rd place. Prizes included: 1st - $300 and 5 future H&P from Skydive Sacramento. 2nd - $60, LiquidSky Swoop Shorts (originally for 1st, but 1st was a sponsored athelete), Z1 helmet provided by Extreme Addiction, and 5 future H&P from Skydive Sac. 3rd - recouped meet fee of $20 and 5 future H&P's. Its been a lot of fun, a lot of work, and its finally paying off with some great competitions. Special thanks to Extreme Addiction who has provided alot of competition markers and windblades. Extreme Addiction also put in the peas that the competitors get to enjoy after the pond. Amanda has also managed and done a great job with all of our volunteer judges. We've been extremely fortunate to have such great support from our local skydiving community to help judge the competitions. Skydive Sacramento, Peter Galli (Canopy Flight Center), LiquidSky, the FLCPA, L&B, Extreme Addiction, and our volunteers have all made this possible. Hope you can join us for the next meet July 23rd at Skydive Sacramento in Lincoln, CA. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

Quotehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoWl1pxVVBU So that video is reckless... and this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdOvODQ7JZs is cool. Got it. The result of the intended swoop should not dictate the judgement, in paragliding and/or skydiving. I find it funny that we condone or tolerate bad judgment with good results and then act surprised when something goes wrong. For the record, I think the pool swoop is fucking awesome...and I didn't read through the thread to see what my initial reaction was. The botched paragliding swoop...well, its nobody's fault but his. This is not directed at you Dorbie...its just interesting to see the difference in attitude based on the result. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

Will - Thank you for your help. It was greatly appreciated. Please tell your sister Jen the same. It was great to have you both out there and we look forward to seeing you on June 18th. Marcel Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

So - Extreme Addiction came through huge and we were able to get the pea gravel in this weekend and the courses up and ready. I've attached a picture of the pea gravel. The meet is this Saturday. We have gotten a few more sponsors to throw in some gear, so a big thanks to Liquid Sky and L&B. Its gonna be a great season. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

Is that the same weekend as US Nationals? Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

My experience has been the Katana has a longer recovery arc, but the crossfire is certainly not close to a Sabre2. It is much closer to a Katana than a Sabre2. A crossfire 2 is in the elliptical category where the sabre2 is generally thought of as a Semi-elliptical. Performance is in the eyes of the pilot. To the OP, jump both and see what you like. Crossfire opens better than the katana. The crossfire might be the best opening canopy on the market as far as on heading and consistency. You may not like 800 ft soft openings though. The crossfire has better glide. The katana will dive hard and will swoop. The crossfire does that very well too, with a shorter recovery arc. My opinion is the crossfire will shut down better than the katana. Bottom line - do not be fooled into thinking the crossfire is "more like a sabre 2". It most certainly is not. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

Update April 29th 2011 The pond is ready for the first competition on May 21st. We have just received our shipment of course markers for the pond, owned and donated by Extreme Addiction Gear and Apparel for the meet. Extreme addiction is also donating her accuracy webbing for this meet. It will be the same webbing design used at the Florida meets. Due to an obstacle at 400+ft, the distance course will not be on the pond. The distance course will be about 200 ft back and offset from the speed and accuracy events. Peter has been doing a lot of work on the course layouts and we have preliminarily marked everything out. We should have the entire setup ready and tested by May 14th. We are looking into peas for the accuracy event at the exit of the pond. That may or may not be completed by the first event, but its something we are working on. Skydive Sacramento has been very supportive of this event and Pat has put a lot of effort, money, and time into something that honestly hasn't done much for him to date. He is in the hole on this swoop park and I appreciate his efforts for our little playground. I hope we can build on this and "give back" to his efforts on this pond. For those of you that don't know, Pat is not a competitive swooper. So his efforts are extraordinary. Skydive Sacramento has started flying their new plane this week, an A90 King Air, that will be used for the event. They also have a C206. We have feedback from 15 + competitors locally and in SoCal that plan to attend the first Meet of 2011. NorCal is about to have some serious competitions!! Hope some of you can make it! Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

Effectively, yes. Exit order is based on freefall portion of the skydive. After opening, pilots move to their dedicated holding areas or "staging areas" based on landing intentions. Most of the high >2.0 wing loadings will be in the high performance area. But there can still be different wing loadings on each "side". But yes, holding area, pattern and landing area are all separated by type of landing you intend to make. This does get people thinking about landing right after opening, and not waiting until 1000ft. Sounds simple and useful.

Last week, my DZ initiated new procedures starting with separate "staging areas" combined with continued separate landing areas that we've been doing for some time. We've effectively created separate air space for both types of patterns from opening to landing. Now comes refinement, enforcement, and continued input and support from our staff, organizers, seasoned up jumpers, newbies, and AFF students. The idea is to get HP pilots and non-HP pilots separated as soon as possible after opening with each type of pilot occupying air space with similar pilots and allowing them to "stack it up" and fill their slot once in the pattern. Horizontal and vertical separation in the staging areas will be emphasized. Its not perfect, but its a start and we can see how practical it is and how well it is enforced. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

I love when I see Lodi in a thread title...but this thread is not very entertaining yet...come on people. Start the bickering. Sorry for my non-informative post. I should add that there are many highly skilled jumpers/riggers/instructors etc. there. I have also jumped there recently. I don't expect you will find the answers you are looking for here, it will be a hung jury. Go to the DZ, talk to Bill yourself and see if he addresses your concerns. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

Thanks. We are up for the challenge. Hope others are too. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

We will do community enforcement. If someone see something and is not comfortable discussing with the individual, they are to come to staff and we'll deal with it. Blatant disregard for the patterns will result in groundings. 1st time infractions based on confusion or in-experience will be dealt with in an educational/informational way. Repeated "not getting it" will be dealt with by remedial training (hop and pops to demonstrate compliance with pattern rules for example) and grounding if necessary. Everyone is on board and we are trying to make a difference. Edit: Yes this includes staff. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

I printed and had laminated the two prevalent wind conditions at my DZ showing the separate landing patterns (HP and Non-HP), staging areas, and "no fly zones". I worked it out with the S&TA and our DZO and had agreement before I got them printed. I then organized a discussion with the entire dropzone after sunset load on Saturday that included the DZO. We agreed to make some subtle changes to language and make the diagrams a bit more "user friendly". It was agreed that enforcement was going to happen and violation of the landing patterns was not going to be tolerated. The posters include the following language next to the landing patter diagrams: -VERTICAL SEPARATION IS REQUIRED -After opening & control checks, proceed to your staging area immediately. Land away from the main landing area if you can't cross the other style pattern landing area above 1,500 FT. - Spiraling in the staging areas below 2,000 FT, except to gain vertical separation, will not be tolerated. -Based on the wind direction, what does your landing pattern look like? Discuss with others before loading. BE VOCAL & BE HEARD -Who are the HP canopy pilots on this load and do they exit in front or behind you? -Where is the staging area for each landing area? (HP and Non-HP areas) -If you fly through the wrong pattern area below 1,500 FT you may be grounded immediately. Additionally, I volunteered to mow some areas to make it an attractive area to land for non-hp canopy pilots (when winds are from the southwest). Its a start...and our meeting on Saturday was awesome. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

I was not being sarcastic. At my DZ, Bay Area Skydiving, prices went back down to $17/ticket when fuel prices came down. Our DZO has no interest in keeping our tickets up when fuel prices come down. To our advantage we have a local DZ that seems to remain at $15/ticket even during fuel escalation. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

You protect yourself by not allowing yourself to get directly under an HP pilot (for those DZ's that separate). We do separate, however, on occasion we have those that are oblivious due to lack of understanding or never getting properly briefed (visiting jumper). My point being, knowing who is an HP pilot on the load, and the exit order...you should under canopy get a visual to where they are and accommodate accordingly. If you need to fly in brakes to let them go by...so be it. If everyone started to pay attention a little bit, and put more than an afterthought into the canopy portion of a skydive we would all be much better off. This goes for everyone...High Performance Pilots and those like my dad jumping 260 challengers. Everyone must pay attention, landing areas must be separated (and enforced)...and it may come down to separate passes if people can't get their act together. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

I'm saying that there is no point to being right if you are dead right. Be defensive, hold everybody to the highest standards and don't make exceptions for anyone. If someone screws up, hold them accountable. 19,000 jumps or 19. Swooping in traffic is irresponsible and shouldn't be allowed for anyone. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

Point taken. But flying defensively is something we all can work on. We video guys land in the same spot almost every load...avoid that area. We do have separate landing areas at my dz so its a bit easier to avoid, but my point is...hp pilots are usually regulars at the dz and very predictable. Obviously, even the best in the business screw up. Don't be there when they do. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

I have to meet this chuck character. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.

And you, and all of us, have the ability to remove ourselves from the equation. You should know where every HP pilot is during your pattern, fly defensively, and never allow yourself to be in a position to be taken out by someone who isn't paying attention. It only takes one person to avoid a collision. Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen God is Good Beer is Great Swoopers are crazy.