RhondaLea

Well, I don't know about that... Not to mention that "the most likely place in the States to be attacked by an alligator (three deaths between 1992 and 1998) is not deep in some swamp, but on a golf course." Stark, P. (2001). Last breath: Cautionary tales from the limits of human endurance. Ballantine. I couldn't find statistics on bowling--all those tornados and other freak occurrences that kill bowlers skew the numbers, don't ya know--but I did turn up a piece Tom Buchanan wrote a couple of years ago with the definitive answer to the question "how safe is skydiving?" along with an internal link to the National Safety Council and an article entitled "What are the odds of dying?" It includes raw numbers, one-year odds and lifetime odds for selected causes of death in the United States only. Someone who has at least an approximate idea of the numbers of active BASE jumpers in the world since 1981 could do the overall historical statistics for the sport, but probably only the numbers for the last three or four years are relevant as a predictor for the future. Edited to add: I'm amazed by the results of the poll so far, so I'd like to know: How many of you folks voting "yes" have ever seen a skydiving accident that resulted in a fatality?

http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~34423~2711626,00.html the edge It's what we do By Jason Blevins and Scott Willoughby Denver Post Staff Writers Article Published: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 Skiers, a paraglider, an ice climber, a kayaker and... Excerpt: Leap of Faith Shane McConkey goes into uncharted territory. Uber-athlete Shane McConkey dropped even the most cynical jaws in the ski world last year by skiing the Eiger in Switzerland. Well, he only skied half of it. Once the snow ended in a 1,000-foot cliff, McConkey threw a couple front flips into the abyss and pulled a parachute ripcord, setting a standard for the 007-inspired, McConkey-fueled sport of skiBASE jumping. This is the same guy who was banned for life at Vail Mountain for flipping upside down twice in a bump contest - the second time in his birthday suit. Now, every kid in the terrain park flips upside down. McConkey sets the bar many years before anyone can even size it up. (5 additional paragraphs follow at linked page)

Before he was here, he was elsewhere: http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=&start=0&scoring=d&enc_author=iIMEexkAAAC0TqYIeQCV5J2Ee2uO0ptPRyc9PcG1Tr1byrtCea8EZg& http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=&start=0&scoring=d&enc_author=RQ-mDBIAAACt4P1NraNfUVsigTxH5lDi8rhlH0Pnl47z4AZhN98BFg& http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=&start=0&scoring=d&enc_author=xYyeIxMAAADBTV_2shsmlkDj8zwvyYjVWMj6vob75xS36mXc24h6ww& I think that's all of 'em. I spent all day yesterday and the day before reading his old posts. There wasn't much about him not to like. rl

I'm a little quick to jump, Nick. Did you see the companion article? It has the full flavor of what you're referring to: http://www.nj.com/news/times/index.ssf?/base/news-2/110828558191840.xml

Well, it starts at Ft. Benning, but moves to Ft. Dix, Burlington County, and the reason for the story is that Weaks now lives in Willingboro, NJ (also in Burlington County). There are a bunch (at least 20, probably more) of "Washington Townships" in New Jersey, but the one referred to here is Robbinsville, Washington Township, Mercer County. (I keep driving down 130 in my head, and I can't figure out where they think they're going to put a plaque.) "The Times" is the modern name of what was known as "The Trenton Times" when I was younger. It's the local regional paper for Mercer and Burlington. So in this case, it's neither jingoism nor ignorance, but merely local human interest. And sad but true, local human interest trumps accuracy in reporting any day. rl

I'm devastated. Knowing what Josh did--and did not--believe, I can bring myself to say only this: that as long as any of us who knew him lives, he lives. He made me think, he made me laugh. I will never forget him. Edited to add: He once wrote to me, quoting his father at the funeral of a good friend: "This is a hell of a way to get people to say nice things about you." I'm just grateful that all the things I can say about him in the here and now are the things that I said to him at one time or another. He was always on my side. Even when we disagreed--which wasn't all that often over the eight or so years I knew him--he was on my side. He was a loyal and loving friend, with a quick wit, a stunning sense of irony and fine, rational mind. And I am so terribly sorry that his light has been extinguished from this world. Love you, Josh. rl

Quote1980- The NPS, in cooperation with the USPA, legalizes jumping for a period of about three months, but changes their policy to prevent jumping after several jumpers are injured, as well as the damage the jumpers were doing to the park (apparently they were leaving too much trash behind). Flatbed 10

No problem here.

I got the same error message the other day when Mick was trying to upgrade his server. You may recall that the upgrade failed. I'm getting the same error message right now, so my bet is we're now in the midst of Mick vs. Blinc server, Round II. rl If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

Thor Alex Excerpt: "In one television commercial for a Norwegian bicycle manufacturer, Kappfjell rides a mountain bike into an abyss." I seem to remember pictures of the smashed up bike, so I don't think he landed with it. But that was a long time ago, and I may be confused.

Will's obituary (one of several), including the names and locations of his survivors. His father continues to administer forshay.org, so he is probably the person to contact . All the information, including snail mail and e-mail addresses and a telephone number is included here: http://www.samspade.org/t/ipwhois?a=www.forshay.org

http://web.archive.org/web/*/theipbc.com/* The link above is probably a lot of work, because unless you know the exact name of the link you're looking for, you'll have to look at most of them. (This sentence will make no sense until you click on the link.) The 1998 http://web.archive.org/web/*hh_/vertical-visions.com/25ipbc1998.html and 1999 http://web.archive.org/web/*hh_/vertical-visions.com/30ipbc1999.html scores are on the archive of the Vertical Visions website, but I couldn't find anything for 2000. I'm still hunting, though, so if I find it, I'll either edit or repost. Caveat: If you try to click on the links of the archived material, you will sometimes get an error message. To look at another archived page, you may have to retype the URL in the search box. rl Edited to add: http://web.archive.org/web/*hh_/www.theipbc.com/scores.html and http://web.archive.org/web/20030210195028/http://www.theipbc.com/bridgedaychamps.html

Old fogey. Or you could go with this, but it's a lot to live up to.

"Random 10" means just that. It might have been there for you, but by the time I looked it was gone. I think the jokers who run this site move stuff around a lot. There are two Birdman clips anyway: http://www.boreme.com/bm/NOV03/a/m_birdman/fr.htm http://www.boreme.com/bm/DEC03/a/m_birdman2/fr.htm If these links don't work, just click the searchbox, type in "Birdman", and both links will come up. rl

On a privately owned board, free speech is not a constitutional right.

It's not so much the issue of winning vs. losing as it is the cost of defending oneself in court. A lot of "winners" in the legal system have found themselves bankrupted by process. rl

...that creative thinking is dead... No more cloud-busting for you.

Speaking of not knowing... ...has anyone heard from Ron Andre? Last I knew he was in Thailand. rl

With only five jumps off a bridge, I'm not a base jumper, I'm just someone with five jumps off a bridge. That being said, I was actively skydiving during the time my daughter was old enough to understand that skydiving is statistically more likely to kill you than a trip to Great Adventure. She was 11 when she saw one of her friends get badly hurt. She was sixteen when one of her best pals--someone who had been a day-to-day presence in her life for a couple of years--died not 30 feet from where she was sitting. She saw the whole, horrible show from start to finish. In between, and even since, people she knows and cares for have died. (Skypunk comes to mind--consider the effect he would have had on a teenage girl, and how she might feel at his passing.) My daughter never had any doubt that mommy could get killed, and she knew that no matter how careful I tried to be, shit has a way of happening. Was she scared? Yes. Did she ever try to keep me off the airplane? Never. But I never tried to persuade Beck that skydiving or BASE (she attended Bridge Day in '96, and she has been present during other BASE trips) is safe. And I never tried to pretend that people do not die or sustain permanent injury jumping. What I did tell her is that anyone can die at any time, and that the only comfort from statistics is the *idea* that one activity is safer than another. One of her skydiver friends was killed riding his bicycle. And he wasn't even *riding* the bicycle when he was killed. It was just a freak accident involving an automobile driver who had difficulty figuring out the difference between the road and the sidewalk. So what my daughter knows is that anything can happen to anyone at any time, and the only real safety any of us possesses is that which we construct inside our own heads. She also knows that if someone isn't doing what they want to do, the whole point of continuing to take breath is lost--i.e., if one spends her entire life doing what someone else thinks is right, proper and good, then whose life is it anyway? The other side of all this, of course, is taking responsibility for one's actions and the consequences of those actions. Beck knew what would happen to her--where she would go, how her life would be--if something happened to me. And that's usually the biggest issue: "What's going to become of me if you die, are paralyzed, rack up hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical bills?" For someone who isn't morally or legally bound to another (i.e., a spouse or a child or an ailing parent), long explanations, justifications and so forth are optional--if you feel like arguing for your lifestyle, it's just an exercise. Or at least it should be. Hanging around with people who want to control how you live isn't very healthy in the long run. On the other hand, if you have made adequate provision for the people in your life who will be impacted by your sudden absence, then the only answer is "this is what I need to do to live, to be happy. It is who I am. And by trying to change me, you condemn me to a different kind of death. One that is slower and far more painful." The sad fact is that the most controlling people in the world are shockingly deficient in self-control. The converse is also true. But it is often difficult to make another person understand that they have enough to handle in their own life without trying to direct the lives of others. I've had some bad moments with my daughter, but no one ever said growing up is easy. What I'm really proud of is that she understands the difference between other-control and self-control, and she knows that anyone who tries to force her into their mold of what she should be does not have her best interests at heart. Finally, if you're trying to explain to a loved one to whom you owe a duty that you should be able to go out and do as you please without regard for their welfare, shame on you. rl P.S. I'm not the only one who talked to my daughter about these things. Credit to several of the skydivers at Lousia, Laurel and DeLand, as well as 416 and, most particularly, 193. If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

570, The irony of irony is that it is rarely understood to be ironic, particularly when the reader has a vested interest of one sort or another in the object of the ironic statement or situation. You may now return to your regularly scheduled food fight. rl If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

Now it's a clicky

When I was out there, Jimmy, the Acampo post office gave me Box 666.

A very wise man--although I did not think so at the time--once said to me: "Someone has to be the one to stop it." In answer to your question, honest people are honest people. Some of the most dishonest, evil people I know are Christian, but that doesn't mean that all--or even most--Christians are dishonest and evil. The same applies to just about any group you want to label, including Satanists. Heinlein said: "Your enemy is never a villain in his own eyes. Keep this in mind, it may offer a way to make him your friend. If not, you can kill him without hate, and quickly." In our society, you can't go around killing people willy-nilly, and the day of the duel is long gone, but the old social form of "cutting someone dead" has its uses. We all make mistakes, and some people find it easier to justify their mistakes than to deal with them head-on. These days, I'm not inclined to be bothered with those who wrong me, and I am equally disinclined to allow them to live rent free in my head. More important, I have learned that it is something worse than counterproductive to drag the uninvolved into my personal vendettas. (Besides which, I have enough of my own to atone for without worrying about what someone else has done, and I don't know anyone to whom that very same precept does not apply.) But that's just me. rl P.S. As to reasons, no one is ever required to explain or justify the reasons for what they do, and sometimes it's better not to. On the other hand, if one does choose to take a stand, it should be with the certainty that the truism--"anything you say or do is guaranteed to offend someone somewhere"--does most certainly apply. If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

Well, if you're saying that you can choose to be on a team or not be on a team, you don't need a reason. But this argument sounds more like an ongoing hoo-rah about the logo and what it represents to you. So, a couple of facts: One, the Danzig logo apparently started life as a Marvel comics character. (Glenn Danzig is a big comics aficionado.) An Interview with the Danzig Logo Two, Glenn Danzig vehemently denies being a Satanist. An Interview with Glenn Danzig Not my kind of lyrics--and I can almost guarantee I wouldn't like the music they're set to--but giving credit where it's due, they are well-crafted. As to the argument between you--whatever it's about--probably too much has been said already. But if anyone wants to have a discussion about whether artists are accountable for what their audience makes of their art, I'm in. "Meaning is what you bring to things, not what you take from them." Lois McMaster Bujold rl If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb